$800 000 melting pot?

[synner]

City of Toronto dished out $ 800 000 Canadian for one of these snowmelters to deal with its large snow piles.

http://www.snowmelter.com/350pd.html

Their thoughts are that melting it will keep the salt out of the river.:confused:

[T-Zab]

So the melting pot eliminates the salt in the water that is created ? Do they filter the water created and then send it into the storm sewers?
I have seen this melter in action at Ohare ( while on the tarmack). These guys know a thing or too about snow removal, an unbeleivable site too see. Allmost all loaders for all aspects of the removal operation. The pile they made in 5 minutes was like a small mountain. The melter would burn it up as quick as they could pile it.
Todd

[Snowboy]

I doubt they do filter it.

I live in Mississauga and live on a Cul-De-Sac with 6 houses on it and it gets cleared by front end loaders into Tandem trucks. I know 2 years ago when we had allot of snow they dumped it on a field (that belonged to the city) and let it melt. The snow from my streets get dumped usualy into the Credit River. They are concerned about salt? How about other chemicals. Oil, Gas, ETC ETC.

What can you do thou. I guess its the same as storm sewers they just are one huge system that goes into little rivers and then into Lake Ontario.


Lets get rid of the snow now and face the problems later.


Its like farmers spreading Human Waste on the Fields that can be bought cheap from a company called Terra Tec. There was something on 60 mins once about how bad that stuff is. The soil gets worse insted of better. Kills all the earth worms and benificial insects in the soil.

Dave.

[business]

Buying this for so much? It is very expensive to run with diesel!
Swallows 400 Gallons of diesel per hour! This machine is not worth $800,000, Maybe $200,000. It's only steel, some burners and a computer! :canada

[Snowboy]

One would think they would use Propane or Natural gas to run this thing of. Propane is cheaper and more efficient to run then diesel? One huge BBQ essentially.

Dave.

[aleksei]

I was looking at some of the smaller models on their website.... looks a lot like they just discharge water next to the unit - that doesn't look like it applies to the larger models, but still.... kind of strange.

aleksei

[Badranman]

Hey guys, that place is about half hour away. I've known one of the guys that works there for about 10 years now. Business has really picked up in the last 5-6 years. They ship those units everywhere. It's pretty cool to see how big some of them are in person.

[Administrator]

Originally posted by Snowboy
One would think they would use Propane or Natural gas to run this thing of. Propane is cheaper and more efficient to run then diesel? One huge BBQ essentially.

Dave.

There is a lot more BTU's in diesel compared to natural gas, or propane.

[wyldman]

Originally posted by Administrator
There is a lot more BTU's in diesel compared to natural gas, or propane.

True.

If I remember correctly,diesel fuel is like 150,000 BTU\Gallon.Propane is 90,000.Natural gas is even less.

[Snowboy]

So why do we heat our homes with natural gas? Cleanliness?

[micah79]

people used to heat with fuel oil. Cleaner, easier to pipe to homes.

[Administrator]

Yes, it's all about emissions and cleanliness, and well as convenience. There's even more BTU's in coal, but it does not burn as clean as other fuels without auxiliary equipment.

[Snowboy]

Speaking of those melting pots. I wonder what it was like to get sucked into one of these machines. Apparently the guy got tossed out the back end of the machine. This machine's business end is deadly. Sharp wide metal feed chain in the front to haul in the ice and snow.

TORONTO, Feb. 23 /CNW/ - A City of Toronto Transportation Services
employee has been taken to Sunnybrook Hospital after being injured this
morning during snow clearing operations.
The employee became trapped in a snow-melting machine that was being
operated in the Midland and Eglinton Avenue area. The worker sustained very
serious injuries as a result of the accident.
"Our first priority is for the full and complete recovery of the
employee," said Gary Welsh, Director of Transportation Services. "Our thoughts
are with him and his family."
"The City of Toronto is co-operating fully with the police and the
Ministry of Labour in the investigation of this matter," added Welsh.

[OldFord]

How would you end up in one of these machine's???

[synner]

I would hope by mistake.

[Snowboy]

Originally posted by OldFord
How would you end up in one of these machine's???

From what I saw on the news, they said he was inspecting the unit. There are supposed to be guards on that steel chain and when the unit is inspected it’s also supposed to be not running..

Guess what? The guard was off and the machine was running. Go figure.

Matt,

That would be a brutal joke to play on someone if it wasnt. People would start to wonder why the water comeing out from the unit was red.

[nsmilligan]

A friend of mine's welding shop builds some of these units, I don't know what the chain would be your referring to. Basically they are a big melting pot, the snow is dumped by loaders into a vat which is heated by a monster blower ( something like a home furnace burner but a LOT bigger) as the snow melts there are pipes to direct the water from the vat. The only moving parts on these are the burner fans pumps driven by a diesel engine, if he fell in the vat he might have been gotten hypothermia ( the water comes out a little above freezing), or he got caught in the drive train.

Bill

[Snowboy]

Originally posted by nsmilligan
I don't know what the chain would be your referring to.
Bill

From what I saw on TV it looked like a wide steel serrated belt. The machine almost looked like a cold planer from the front but no big belt in the air. This machine was older apparently so it might not resemble what your friend builds now a days. From what I saw there is no loader involved in this operation, this machine pickups up the windrows that are on the side of the street.

[nsmilligan]

The link was to the Trecan units which I've seen being built and running, I think the machine your talking about is the self propelled snowmelter the City of TO bought years ago. Quite a different animal.

Bill

[bud16415]

If anyone wants to learn a bit more about melting snow and the problems and energy associated with doing it I found this paper written about it. It explains ”Phase Change” something a lot of people don’t realize requires massive amounts of BTU’s to make happen. And also the draw backs to heated driveways etc.

http://www.tesmar.com/html/snowmelt_design.html

City planning and also residential planning never seems to consider leaving room for snow storage. So that mother nature can get rid of the snow just like she brought it. Around here I see a lot of residential landscaping that just doesn’t work from a snow removal standpoint and all the new parking lots are mazes of curbs islands and planters. These things are very attractive in SC but don’t work well up here. I have seen so many directional signs flattened in islands this winter along with cars hung up on these stupid things.

IMO far less energy is required to move snow than to think about melting it. The real problem is no one leaves a place to move it to. With all the talk about alternative energy what better use of solar power than to melt snow.

Bud

[Snowboy]

Bud

Looks is everything these days. People don’t want to see tons of grassland just for snow storage.

They want to see Trees Gardens rockery nice fancy attractive sharp looking stuff.

I find when designers do designs for residential places they don’t take into account the fact how big the stuff will get later on, so they try to fill in as much space as they can. Looks nice for 5 or 6 years then you gota start hacking the shrubs and that looks brutal.

Dave.

[bud16415]

Dave

You are right about things changing. I grew up in the day when the roof on your house had two surfaces. I was talking to a roofer the other day said he just did one with 27. People see that as a great looking design. He and I saw it as 27 more places to leak.
I think there is a mix that has to be maintained in design if its buildings or landscaping between form and function. Last summer I watched a nice PVC fence being built along a property line on one of our major roads thru town. And I thought the city plow is going to raise havoc this winter with it. I saw last week half the pickets were up in the front yard and the poles were leaning in. I can just see them complaining to the township about the damages. I also see people planting salt sensitive plants right up to the road.
I really think you can have great looking designs and still allow for snow removal etc. but someone has to think about up front.

I know this is getting off topic but what do you guys do when you go out in the summer to quote a residential plow job and there is a garage at the end plantings both sides not allowed to push across the street and not allowed to push it back along the curb line?

Bud

[SIPLOWGUY]

We used them at the airport and this year NYC used them.