Which truck to buy?

[cat320]

Now I'm listing this here because it will be a business decision ?

With all the new engines and trannies out there which one is good? I am no way starting any kind of brand war but just want un-bias opinions on ford or chevy pick ups.

Now comparing the 2 diesel engines is one.
The automatic trainies in another.
The 4 WD for both ,Ford you have to go out and lock & GM is auto.
The front ends, tortion bars or now coil over with a mono beam axel for Ford .

Who has fixed there probelms? are both engines running good with no major recalls or failures for the 2004 year?

I was always a GM person I liked the look and so forth but now I think it is just a matter of buying equipment that will do the job and not be in the shop. And if you ask why I did not mention Dodge I really do not like any one the dealers that are close enough for me to make it worth while for buying one not that i don't like the cummings.

[snonut12]

With the problems I have heard about 6.0L PSD I think you better stay away from them even thought it seem that the problem is diminishing.

Can't speak for tranny since I don't own any diesel but have heard good stuff about Allison ... it seems that they got the bugs fixed.

My truck has the electronic pushbutton ... went through a couple of winter seasons so far without a problem at all. ;)

Torsion bars ... well okay here we go again. I'll keep this brief. For those who think torsion bars are bad, what make you think they are bad? I never have heard a single story of torsion bars breaking or weakening on other forums so this is a good indication that this is not an issue. "Torsion bars can't handle the extra weight of plow so you are pretty much limited" blah blah - that is just a BS ... it can handle whatever as long as it is within manufacturer rating. I have put HD Fisher plow on mine and it have been absolutely troublefree. Only a couple easy modifications are to crank up the torsion bars to give a bit more height to level the plow and also adding a set of Timbrens will signifcantly reduce front end dipping. That's all you have to do with GM trucks.

As for the diesel motor ... last time I checked the Duramax and Cummins is too close to call. Forget about PSD they are far behind. Since you have the Cummins eliminated due to lack of good dealer support... then I guess the remaining option is the Duramax. I don't think you could go wrong with it ... I have been following through in other forum and it seems that they are pretty reliable diesel motor. In case if you havn't heard, GM made a significant improvement on the newer LLY which include easy to change injectors that you could do it yourself.

[Pelican]

cat, for a pickup I wouldn't buy either one. Dodge is the way to go with the Cummins. I've had too many issues with my Fords that shouldn't have been, my friend has had problems with his Chevy, so much so that GM bought it back.

You can't beat the Cummins diesel for durability. It is an industrial engine adapted to fit a pickup, whereas the PowerStroke and DuraMax were developed for light truck use. The difference being the Cummins was designed to work long hours in heavy equipment, medium duty trucks, large generators and pumps, etc., and the other two were designed only for light truck use. As a result, the Cummins is a much stouter engine.

If Dodge offered a 550 sized truck with low frame rails, I'd have bought it in a heart beat. For cab and chassis use, their frames are just too high for my operation, the load height is almost a foot higher. The pickups are about the same though, GM might be a little lower.

[snonut12]

Pelican - I agree with you that Cummins would be the best choice however the only problem is that it is wrapped inside the Dodge. ;) Dodge really is not that bad, but I don't like their interior and it is not quite comfortable however that may have changed for '04 when Dodge came out with new body design (very nice). I think I have heard that interior had a major overhaul but I am yet to see it in person. But since cat320 mentioned that it would be a work truck then it probably would not matter that much I guess.

I like everything about my GM truck however it would be nice if GM would give it a bit more ground clearance. :grinz

[Pelican]

I couldn't fit in the last series Dodge pickup, there wasn't enough leg room, but at the Auto Show I tried the new series out and they've opened them up quite a bit. I can even wear my hat inside!

[BWhite]

Since you are not considering Dodge . I would go with the Chevy or GMC diesel / Allison combination . As far as interiors none of them are that impressive . I did hear that Ford is redoing its Superduty line ?

[cat320]

It seams that now when you buy a truck they are still working out the kinks.I like the the way the dmax has easy to replace parts. The ford still has a sold front axel and now has the trailer brake included with the tow package . I was a little disapointed when I drove a c4500 with the dmax/alli combo This truck had now power maybe it is undersized for that truck and better in the pick ups here's a pic of it

[snonut12]

That's a good looking truck. If I am not mistaken they got a good tight turning radius. I would say that I was surpised when I looked at the 4500/5500 series brochure that they comes with 8.1 gasser with an option to upgrade to Duramax. I mean who would want a gasser on this medium duty truck?? :confused:

[JohnnyU]

I'm surprised that you thought the Dmax was lackin in power, even in the medeuim duty trucks. I've driven a few of the 2003 model and one of the new LLY models in a pickup, by george that thing was a hoss.

I will be purchasing a Duramax/Allison ext cab/longbed here in a next year or two, winner over the ford hands down, and I am with Stephen about the Dodge interiors, they just aren't my thing.


However, that's just my $0.02, I guess that's all we can offer.

[cat320]

this was the load that it had in it and this load was a little more than the rest but i have seen alot of guys with the same size truck and bed have that much if not more. I could of been just that truck maybe it had the lesser HP of the dmax choices for it. But even empty it did not have what the 6.0 ford had. but I would want to test drive both in a pick up .

[Pickering Snow]

Iam with Steve on this one i too have had a bunch of little stuipd things go wrong with my ford fleet i will say i do love the 6.0 psds alot of bull**** about them is passing quickly have had little or no trouble with my two.

I worked for a cpd dealer and i would be troubled buying a chrys product not knowing what direction there headed i two love the cummins and wish it were in a ford chassis lol.

Honestly though iam tired of spending all the money on trucks and not getting what i pay for iam going back to old school ways from know on and that is this 26 yrs in the auto buss iam gonna buy used trucks and refurbish them i will have less money in them than the 40k plus i have been spending and when something goes wrong ill only have my self to blame

[capnkel]

I have had my FORD 6.0 since september 03,10,000 trouble free miles so far,and loving every one of them.I read all the horror storys over at the diesel stop,i think i even saw a couple post of yours(cat 320)like most new things,there are growing pains,i think ford has pretty much got those out of the way now.I would buy another in a minute without thinking twice.If you're like most of us,a quick search on the other diesel sites provides some intersting reading,seems the dmax is still having injector troubles,and they have a big head start on the 6.0 Personally,if i could have my choice of engines,i'd take a detroit in my ford.there are rumuors around that it may happen in the future,possibly as a v6 for the f150s.

[Mark Oomkes]

If I could build a truck my way, it would be Ford cab\chassis\suspension with a Cummins and the Allison out of the GM.

Now back to the real world. We have had very good luck with our Ford's, both 7.3's and 6.0. The worst thing we've had other than normal maintenance is a cam sensor went out last year on one of our 7.3's. We're at 70K with that one, about 30K with our next and about 10K with our 6.0. We are still trying to get an occasional slow shift diagnosed\repaired on the 6.0, but other than that it has been fine. They did a software upgrade mid winter last year and an alternator upgrade for free even though we are running central hydraulics.

I have heard quite a few rumors about all the 6.0 problems. As far as I can tell, these were all the first 'run' of engines and yes they did have problems just like GM did with Dmax and Chrylser did with their V10. It just appears that GM and Ford were able to get their problems fixed quicker than Chrysler did with the V10.

We have a very good dealer with excellent service for our Fords. Our Chrysler dealer was OK, but not great. It was usually 2 weeks before we could get into them, and then the truck would sit there for at least 1 day before they would start on it. Along with getting recalls for stupid little things for at least the first 6 years, I sort of got turned off on Dodges. Maybe the new models are better, but I'm not ready to try a Dodge again until Ford screws something up.

I would not hesitate to buy another Ford, actually I am getting prices for another 550 with a flat bed, 8611 and back plow. If I don't order this truck it will be a 350 crew cab with an 810 and back plow (and Sidewing).

[business]

After carefull review of all trucks available, I have bought 2 2004 Ford superstroke F-350 diesel. I've had them for the past 6 months and so far, no problem with any of them. (beside the electric seat who stopped moving!) A lot of plowers down here are staying away from Dodge products because of bad transmission. Also, a lot of people are staying away from Chevy's due to their Bosch injectors from europe. They can only take 40 ppm in sulfur content in diesel fuel but here in Canada, the content is close to 500 ppm, which means that the injectors are getting clogged up quite often and need to be changed. Also, when Chevy's carry a plow, the front goes way down leaving about 6 inches of space in between the ground and the sub-frame of the plow. As for the Ford, they hold the plow straight up, goes down about 2 inches with still about 12 inches under the truck. Keep in mind, the diesels from duramax and cummins are much quieter than the ford one but I have 325 HP and 560 ft/lb of torque to play with!

[BKrois]

My boss has an 04 F550 w/ the 6.0L diesel. It has almost 7k miles and they've been trouble free. The truck has a lot of power, and it'll pull a big load in the truck with a machine on the trailer with no problem at all in the tow/haul mode.


Try one for yourself, it seems as though lots of people have heard about problems with the trucks through their friends cousin who knew someone.......

[Pelican]

Bryan, it is a fact that the early or first year's run of Ford 6.0 PowerStrokes had serious problems. Turbos flew apart, excessive fuel leaked into the crankcase, and there were programming glitches among other issues. John D can tell you of one dealer who had a line up of SuperDutys in back for engine replacement. They seem to have worked out the problems now, but these failures did exist.:geez

[Mark Oomkes]

Sounds similar to the problems that GM was\is having with the Dmax. Our Exmark dealer has a bunch of Dmax's that they are having these same problems with. Except, the dealer is not (last I heard) was not replacing any engines. They were 'fixing' them and then having the same thing happen over and over.

I forgot about 2 other repairs on our 350 with 70K. We replaced the 'automatic' hub locks after 3 seasons and the alternator went out last winter.

[snonut12]

Actually the problem GM had with previous Duramax is the injectors. People who have the older version of Duramax (LB7) sometime would have problem with bad injectors as the time progresses. And it is not easy to change the injectors I heard. I guess this is why GM has the external mounted injectors on the LLY so the owners could change it out easily. Also it seems that there is no issue with injectors in the LLY too.

[Pelican]

There were programming problems with the early Duramaxs too. My friend had one of the first 2500s in the area with the Duramax, it would just die unexpectedly, then restart with no apparent problems. He had an idle surge too that wouldn't go away. GM finally bought the truck back from him, he bought another 1 year newer and has had no problems with it.

I never buy newproducts when they are released for this reason. The manufacturers risk their reputation as evidenced here by rushing a product to market that hasn't had the bugs worked out. The 6.0 PowerStroke debacle will remain in people's minds for a long time to come.

[EZSnow]

Just wanted to go back and address this...

The 4 WD for both ,Ford you have to go out and lock & GM is auto.

Not so-
If you take a closer look at Ford hubs, the two positions are "lock" and "auto". (not "free") If chevy hubs don't lock in, you have 2wd- if my hubs don't lock in, I get out and switch them. There's also a mod that lets you disable the front hub shift, which gives you access to 2LO... sweet!

[ratlover]

chevy has no hubs, the cv's always turn. it enguages/disenguages in the center section and in the transfercase

older duramaxes are pretty known for injectors not being the greatest. BTW the Bosh HPCR injection system looks very simmilar between the Cummins and the Duramax.....well dodge is missing a few injectors ;) hehe just razzing you sheep heads Chevy dosnt use a lift pump and dodge does.

the duramax in the med trucks is a detuned motor, same motor as the PU's but the programing cuts down the 300+ hp

all the T bars and chevy ifs is weak comments crack me up. I mean like seriously crack me up. I have a 9'6" fisher ez v and with timbrens and the balast my front end drops under 1.5". Thats less than my dads 550 with a 10' boss V. 4x4 launches with boost havent killed my IFS yet either. screw 325hp.....I'm running 425 with plans in the works for a more. and yes I am doing 4x4 launches with boost on dry pavement with over 800# of torque. Havent broke my wimpy ifs yet. Doing launches over 3 psi can bend stock tie rods BTW.....I bought some sleeves for 75$ shipped and am now golden

Although the Ford dosnt seem as refined and the ford trany dosnt seem to be holding the power as well as the allision and parts are hard coming for upgrades(if you arnt going to be hot rodding your truck this dosnt matter) The truck itself isnt bad. I thought of buying on but in 03 the 6.0 just scared the piss outa me......if you feel confidednt in the 6.0 now then its a much closer battle between ford/chevy.

Dealer support and a good tech would play as heavy into a decision as anything. 90% of the "I have had my truck into the dealer X times for the same problem" or related stuff constatly going south is a dealer tech problem not a truck problem. Think about the odds in the stories.....3 tranys in 50k, think about what that kinda avereage failure rate would work out to if it was representitive of the whole line. You would see x vehical littering the road. I'm not saying some things arnt junk but cumon!

[PSDF350]

Originally posted by wxmn6
With the problems I have heard about 6.0L PSD I think you better stay away from them even thought it seem that the problem is diminishing.

Can't speak for tranny since I don't own any diesel but have heard good stuff about Allison ... it seems that they got the bugs fixed.

My truck has the electronic pushbutton ... went through a couple of winter seasons so far without a problem at all. ;)

Torsion bars ... well okay here we go again. I'll keep this brief. For those who think torsion bars are bad, what make you think they are bad? I never have heard a single story of torsion bars breaking or weakening on other forums so this is a good indication that this is not an issue. "Torsion bars can't handle the extra weight of plow so you are pretty much limited" blah blah - that is just a BS ... it can handle whatever as long as it is within manufacturer rating. I have put HD Fisher plow on mine and it have been absolutely troublefree. Only a couple easy modifications are to crank up the torsion bars to give a bit more height to level the plow and also adding a set of Timbrens will signifcantly reduce front end dipping. That's all you have to do with GM trucks.

As for the diesel motor ... last time I checked the Duramax and Cummins is too close to call. Forget about PSD they are far behind. Since you have the Cummins eliminated due to lack of good dealer support... then I guess the remaining option is the Duramax. I don't think you could go wrong with it ... I have been following through in other forum and it seems that they are pretty reliable diesel motor. In case if you havn't heard, GM made a significant improvement on the newer LLY which include easy to change injectors that you could do it yourself. i'm sorry but your way of base here you haven't clue what your talking about. i have an 04 f350 psd and it is by far the best truck i have ever owned:burnout

[PSDF350]

Originally posted by EZSnow
Just wanted to go back and address this...



Not so-
If you take a closer look at Ford hubs, the two positions are "lock" and "auto". (not "free") If chevy hubs don't lock in, you have 2wd- if my hubs don't lock in, I get out and switch them. There's also a mod that lets you disable the front hub shift, which gives you access to 2LO... sweet! thats not true it is lock and free. at least mine are.

[Rob]

I have a 2000 F250 with the electronic shift 4WD and it is LOCK and AUTO.

[PSDF350]

the electronics are that way so you have shift on the fly. but if your are plowing lock them but if you are just tring to cross a muddy field or something similar you dont need to. but they are strongest when locked.

[snonut12]

Originally posted by PSDF350
i'm sorry but your way of base here you haven't clue what your talking about. i have an 04 f350 psd and it is by far the best truck i have ever owned:burnout

Ummm.... perhaps you should read my post again? :rolleyes:

Originally posted by wxmn6
With the problems I have heard about 6.0L PSD I think you better stay away from them even thought it seem that the problem is diminishing.

I said that it appears that the problem is diminishing. The problem first came out on 2003 model trucks. You mentioned that you have the 2004 model so you probably have better one than those who were unfortunate.

Also Pelican posted this earlier that you probably missed:

Originally posted by Pelican
it is a fact that the early or first year's run of Ford 6.0 PowerStrokes had serious problems. Turbos flew apart, excessive fuel leaked into the crankcase, and there were programming glitches among other issues. John D can tell you of one dealer who had a line up of SuperDutys in back for engine replacement. They seem to have worked out the problems now, but these failures did exist.

[PSDF350]

what would you like me to read? you basicaly said the psd's were junk. i have 14000 miles on mine since feb 26 and the truck is just plain awsome.

[snonut12]

Ok, that's fine with me. You have the right for your own opinion. Your truck may be running fine but someday when it turn crap on you I would suggest getting this unit as a backup. ;)

[PSDF350]

i will need one more so the wife can help to. wouldn't want her to feel left out.