Cummins alternator upgrades - LEECE NEVILLE

[wyldman]

A lot of guys have been asking about my alternator and battery upgrades on my truck.

Here is a link to the Turbo Diesel register,where I originally did the alternator write up.

TDR Alternator upgrade thread (http://www.turbodieselregister.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=34554)

Have fun,it's a long read :D

(((Edit: You MUST be a Member at TDR to view anything more than the first post Chris made. ~Chuck)))

[Matthew Bowman]

wyldman - did you have troubles with your alternator keeping up? Just curious because I was surprised at how well mine keeps up running a blizzard 810, electric v-box, flashing lights etc. The Ford (older 7.3 idi) has a hard time keeping up with the western and needs to have the alternator upgraded (its always been this way, new alternator or old), but I'm impressed at how the dodge charging system keeps up with everything.

[wyldman]

The factory alternator did an OK job,but it died after about 4 years.A replacement rebuild was $360,the Leece-Neville was new,and was only $239.00 CDN.Way cheaper and 3 times what the factory alternator was.It was a no brainer.

You can find them new for less than $140 US.Do the upgrade while yours stll works,and sell it on e-bay to recoup some of the upgrade costs.

[John DiMartino]

I finally did this upgrade to my truck.i have been putting it off since I added the sidewing plow last year.The stock Dodge system is amazing considering what i have put mine thru.My stock,original alternator is still in perfect condition with 110,000 miles on it. I am on my 2nd set of batterys, i replaced the originals as PM last fall.My stock sytem never had a hard time keeping up until i added the wing plow,and 4 extra lights. I already had added a ton of electrical acessorys including hi output stereo,strobes,extra fuel pump,and a few other things.After putting the Leece Neville alternator on my truck yesterday, I wondered why i didnt do it sooner.This thing is a beast.It literally bolted in my ram with a few spacers.It took me a while to cut the spacers to just the right lenth ,and to cut down bushings for the lower mount,but it was time well spent. After the install i noticed that the voltage didnt drop much when the grid heaters kicked in. This morning was the test,and I intentionally left everything on in the truck to see what the Leece Neville could do.I left the headlights on/fog lights/heater on hi/wipers/radio,4 extra lights/twin 55 watt rotator/strobes/and then plowed like that.Amazingly sitting there idling the voltmeter hovered on 14 the whole time,cycling the 810 didnt even drop the guage! When i hit extend on the wing it finally dropped to 12 as it was about to finish.But it takes up to 12 + seconds to fully extend the wing plow.The guage recovered in less than 20 seconds to where it was before.If i have done this with the stock alt, the low voltage chime would have kicked on,and the voltmeter would have been on 9 volts.So i plowed with everything on for a few hrs,and the truck never got behind so to speak.i never had to sit and rev it to charge or let it recover like before,I had to sit at 2000RPM for 30 seconds after i cycled the wing plow. This afternoon I went by the auto electric store to show them how it came out,and my freind Steve brought out the amp meter.Sitting there idiing after plowing all day hot,it would put out 123amps continously.i revved it up a tad to 1500 and the output jumped to over 150 amps.This is hot output.Yesterday cold it put over 185 amps out before there test engine started to bog down.I took a pic of it,i tried to get more,but the batterys died in the cold. Ill get more once i get new batterys. A big thank you to Wyldman for pushing me to do this swap.I never would have done it without his constant nudging:D .Im going to nudge anyone thinking about this to go for it.This alt rocks big time. I think my batterys are weak from deep cycling them so much,but it didnt seem to matter, the leece neville was able to keep up with things 99% of the time.

[BWhite]

When I run the front plow /back plow / headights on, the back plow will bottom out the charging system and activate the chime .Takes 10 sec to bring the voltage back . THis maybe what I need . Where do you get the alt ?

[wyldman]

Bill - most auto electric shops will have them,but forget about putting it on your truck,it won't fit.These things are HUGE.The inline 6 of the diesel gives you the room needed,and a lot of these motors were designed to use a big alt for bigger trucks.

It's about time you got it done John.Now it's time to get those bigger batteries in there....nudge,nudge,nudge....... ;)

[BWhite]

Guess I will plow only during the day LOL or with the headlights off / parking lights only . Actually I just remembered I installed the Mopar fog lights and I have them on ......worthless while plowing . Maybe this is why I have this problem this winter and not last winter . I installed the light kit in the spring . I think I may have solved my problem . The foglights must have a good draw ?

[wyldman]

Most factory fogs use a 35 watt bulb.So that's 70 watts,which is around 6 amps or so.Not too much,but every little bit helps.Keeping lights off,heater turned down,etc will help too.Hold the truck in a lower gear to keep the RPM up between sites,or between passes,to help the alt charge betterh

You have two plows,that's what is killing it.Get bigger batteries (add a second if you don't already have one),and that will help keep the voltage up for a longer period.You may also be able to find a better alternator which is a direct bolt on for your truck.

Just for comparison,here is a pic of the Leece-Neville,beside some normal GM alternators,you can see just how huge it really is.

[CraftyBigDog]

Guys do you have a link where to get one of these alternators? Im might need one. Hey John, man its hard to get use to that wingplow man does that thing stickout quite aways!

[synner]

In Canada they sell the alternators at www.traction.com.

[wyldman]

A lot of places carry these in rebuit versions.Don bother,as a new one is only $20 more.

They can be found at most heavy truck electrical shops,heavy truck dealers,and heavy truck parts outlets.A lot of them are open 24/7,and have a few sitting on the shelf.

[CraftyBigDog]

Will it bolt right in!

[John DiMartino]

On my truck it literally bolted on with a few spacers that i made up.Since you have an auto with thr stock cooler mounted on the engine you wil need to reroute the 5/8" hoses going to the log cooler.My log cooler got the axe 2 yrs ago when i twinned my truck.Other than that it was easy,just takes some time and patience making up spacers and fittting it in place.I also had to cut .035 off the pulley,but that was no big deal.When your done you can literally run whatever you want as far as lights go and not worry:D .Even with the wing plow and front plow.Jason,just go get one of these,you wont regret it, pm Wyldman or me for info on the spacers.

[wyldman]

Jason - it pretty much bolts on.The only thing you need to do besides the spacers is make an extension for the upper mount,and reroute some hoses for the trans cooler.Read the TDR thread (in the first post) for more info.

[BWhite]

I think its about time for the manufacturers to up the ante with the alternators they provide with the snowplow packages - Amperage and extreme durability . I would pay a premium for it

[John DiMartino]

Wyldman says it wont fit,but i want to try to put one of these leece nevilles on my 91 GMC.The problem is the 4" mounting spacing,most car/trucks use a 2" spacing.On the CTD its like it was meant to have the Leece Neville,which it very well might have considering the heavy duty construction and use in MD trucks.If you can get the back bottom ear to mount properly and it fits this alt shoud fit on a few other trucks.I think we would need to get the alt off to the side a lot with custom brackets and a longer belt. it would be a lot of work,with that said im still going to see if I can do it on the GMC. When i had this unit load tested it was runing all day plwoing hard with both plows, I pulled into the alt shop,my buddy there didnt think i could fit it on the little Dodge pickup,he was amazed at how good it fit,and looked factory.He loaded the system and we sat there and watched the alt that was running all day put out 123 amps continous,he held it for a while,and then loaded it to the max it put out 150-157 amps. I reached down and touched the case and it was cool to the touch.My stock alt(a denso) if i did that it ran hot,so IMO the beauty of this alternaotr is also its ability to dissipate the heat produced ,and run at hi amperages non stop relailably.
Jason,on my truck I did not need the spacer for the upper bracket,I dont know if you will either. It fit right on i just made up a custom sleeve to fit in behind the leece neville ear,and snugged it down with the stock upper bolt.

[Mark Oomkes]

Originally posted by BWhite
I think its about time for the manufacturers to up the ante with the alternators they provide with the snowplow packages - Amperage and extreme durability . I would pay a premium for it

Surely you're joking, Bill. I know this doesn't fit in exactly, but Ford can't even build a transmission that will stand up to plowing. I was at the auto dhow last night and I may have to check out Dodge again. Really like the looks of the Power Wagon. Just need a diesel in it.:burnout

I need to buy another truck, would like a 1 ton pickup, SRW, crew cab, diesel. Is this available from Dodge? Or would it have to be a 3/4 ton? Looked at the Chevy's too, but just can't get over the torsion bar suspension.

[synner]

1 ton pickup, SRW, crew cab, diesel. Is this available from Dodge? Or would it have to be a 3/4 ton?

Mark, Dodge offers this now in the 3500 truck as well as the 2500. Only difference is about 800 dollars Canadian. I spec'd them out and could only find differences in the spring ratings, other than that they appear to be the same truck. Also found it easier to locate a 2500 quad cab diesel then a 3500 with the SRW.

[Mark Oomkes]

Originally posted by synner
Mark, Dodge offers this now in the 3500 truck as well as the 2500. Only difference is about 800 dollars Canadian. I spec'd them out and could only find differences in the spring ratings, other than that they appear to be the same truck. Also found it easier to locate a 2500 quad cab diesel then a 3500 with the SRW.

Hmmmmm. I'd be fine with waiting for one. I think I'll have to make a trip down to the Dodge dealer.

[wyldman]

Originally posted by John DiMartino
Wyldman says it wont fit,but i want to try to put one of these leece nevilles on my 91 GMC.The problem is the 4" mounting spacing,most car/trucks use a 2" spacing.On the CTD its like it was meant to have the Leece Neville,which it very well might have considering the heavy duty construction and use in MD trucks.If you can get the back bottom ear to mount properly and it fits this alt shoud fit on a few other trucks.I think we would need to get the alt off to the side a lot with custom brackets and a longer belt. it would be a lot of work,with that said im still going to see if I can do it on the GMC. When i had this unit load tested it was runing all day plwoing hard with both plows, I pulled into the alt shop,my buddy there didnt think i could fit it on the little Dodge pickup,he was amazed at how good it fit,and looked factory.He loaded the system and we sat there and watched the alt that was running all day put out 123 amps continous,he held it for a while,and then loaded it to the max it put out 150-157 amps. I reached down and touched the case and it was cool to the touch.My stock alt(a denso) if i did that it ran hot,so IMO the beauty of this alternaotr is also its ability to dissipate the heat produced ,and run at hi amperages non stop relailably.
Jason,on my truck I did not need the spacer for the upper bracket,I dont know if you will either. It fit right on i just made up a custom sleeve to fit in behind the leece neville ear,and snugged it down with the stock upper bolt.

It will be real tight.Not due to the ear spacing,but the overall physical size of this monster.Either it would have to sit way up in the middle (above the intake),or way off to the side (to clear the exhaust manifolds).Due to the size and weight,bracketry would be huge,as it has to hang a long way off the motor.

The only solution I can see,is using solid motor mounts,and the mounting the alternator to the truck frame,with the alt body facing forward.This would give you a good strong mounting,a reasonable belt length,and it would be away from a lot of heat.

Here is a pic of my old Chevy II with a similar setup.It's the only way it would work on most trucks too,due to the size of the case.

[John DiMartino]

Wyldman, locally they call me and my brother Vinnie the A team:D .We have a torch and welder,and will make it fit;) .Seriously after using this alt for just one storm im trying to think of how to fit one on everything i own.I even find myself peeking under my hood,just to look at it:D

[76chevyman]

Wyldman, locally they call me and my brother Vinnie the A team .We have a torch and welder,and will make it fit .Seriously after using this alt for just one storm im trying to think of how to fit one on everything i own.I even find myself peeking under my hood,just to look at it

When you get it to fit in your s10 blazer let me know :D


Rich:burnout

[John Banks]

Hey, did anyone else notice the paint color in Chris' pic? And here I thought Bill and Jay were the only guys with that formula! LOL :grinz

[wyldman]

I figured someone would pick up on the color.Here is a better shot of the whole car.

[Chuck Smith]

I know this is a very old thread. I just moved it to Projects, and made it a Sticky. I had a customer in my shop yesterday, and we got to talking about these alternators. He worked for Ford for 20+ years. He said the Leece was originally developed for Ford police cars. He went on to say they are a 3 phase alternator, and that somehow on the front side you can pick up AC power. Enough to run a small welder, or send to a transformer and run whatever the alternator can keep up with.

Maybe Chris, Johnny, or Fred can chime in on the 3 phase details?

~Chuck

[wyldman]

All Alternators are 3 phase AC,and the current is then sent through a rectifier to create DC voltage.The rectifier is just a bunch of diodes that allow positive current through,but block the negative current when the AC alternates.

Some Leece Nevilles had large external regulators that the AC taps were easily accessible.