Plow route time

[Clean Cut Lawns]

How long does it take you guys to complete your final run route from start to finish?

[JD PLOWER]

That depends on the storm and the amount of help we have. 4-6 vehicles on a 4" snowfall is 6-7 hours but that has a lot variabilty as well, since the storm could drag out or travel time is effected if its during the day and traffic is heavy.

[Snoworks]

We try to stay around four to five hours for a 2" - 4" snowfall. We have specific completion times listed in our contracts, so plow times are critical!

Chuck B.

[wyldman]

The average storm has us out for 6-8 hours,start to finish.Big storms can keep us busy for days !

[Clean Cut Lawns]

how do you deal with storms that "end" at say around 5am?
if you have lots that need to be open by 7 or 8am . I mean I know its tough but how do you know when you have exceeded timely service?

Thanks

[JD PLOWER]

If a storm ends at that time we have a priority list that we follow. Medical places first, hotels second, and 24hr manufacturing or shipping third and retail is last, but thats a relative term, last means they can get into their properties but the others require a higher level of service and sometimes zero accumulation particularly during daytime hours. Basically I think you need an emergency plan if you get snow at the worst times and plenty of help.

[Pickering Snow]

Clean Cut that is a very good question jd answers it well. Its alot of exper and alot of managing when the storm stops at 5 am first off what we do is still start around 2am i will go in and have the guys take the snow thats down has it approaches buss opening times my guys all know the buss and there opening times and they will do them per that time , this does become a good topic and is one of the reasons i have ended up with so much dam equipment cause almost every buss we do needs to be done most by 6am some by 5am and a good number by 7am if i get in a real jamb i start bringing the resi trucks off there routes and in to help my commerical teams. This year with the adding of the new f350 freds gonna become a floater its the first time in 16yrs i will not have a specific route i will be running the whole sector of are route helping both commercial teams by doing this we will beale to keep our accounts opened on time.

I think this whole topic is great cause the majority of accounts need that early open time and i think it really limits how much work a company can take on if they have limited equipment , the accounts i have picked up over the years were the other contractor was fired was because the place wasnt plowed on TIME has far has time on the total plow run were at 6to8 hrs with all jobs getting finished commerical, churches, condos , and resi

[BWhite]

With residential it's a bit easier . During a large storm as long a you keep up with it most customers are willing to (brave ) driving thorugh about 5 inched of snow if the really have to get out . Customers know they can always call if they have a special request and I am very aware of the needs of any customers that are emergency personal . I can see with commericial ....it has to be ready for opening time .

[grasshopper]

We've got about 9-10 hours per truck on an average snowfall. W start generally at 2:30 am get the commercial lots done first. We then split up into three routes, one light residential (snowblowing) and two other residential (apartments/condos etc).

Usually we are done at noon.

[Clean Cut Lawns]

grasshopper,

how do your customers deal w/ only getting done by noon? don't the leave in the morning?

WE always try to have everyone cleared out by 7am

some of the commercials have to be done by 6am b/c of employees?

[Chuck Smith]

I have always believed in completing the route at least once in 4 - 6 hours. For larger storms, the same applies, at least once at each site in 4 - 6 hours. MOST customers want to be cleared in a reasonable time frame. If your route takes 8 hours to do once, then that means that some of your customers will be waiting about 8 hours to get plowed for the first time. For most customers, that is unacceptable. I would not feel comfortable making anyone wait that long to see a truck on their site for the first time.

And yes, as many have said, there are many variables, and experience plays a big part in juggling the accounts to keep them all satisfied. It all starts with route planning long before the first flakes fall.

In all my years plowing on my own, and when I actually controlled when equipment arrived on site, I never had any complaints. I had questions as to when the trucks would return to finish up, or to plow again, but never any complaints. Part of this is due to the fact that I would lay it out to customers when discussing the contract specifications. Let them know what they can expect.

I found it shocking when speaking to some contractors who had signed a particular contract that called for service within 2 hours of a snowfall, and they told me it takes them 8 hours to do their routes once. They know for sure that at least some of those 2 hour response time sites would be waiting 8 hours, and they were OK with it. I just could not believe it.

When the heavy snow comes, they would take 14 hours+ to get to those sites the first time!

Amazing. :huh

Commercial sites can often be pacified, as I said before by laying it all out for them long before the snow flies. As long as you meet their expectations, then both parties are happy.

For instance, learing entrances, exit and laneways, loading docks, making a few passes in front of the buildings, clearing a portion of the lot, etc...

~Chuck

[sno-mover]

I'm usually out for 8 hrs for 2"- 4", I sub for a guy and where I plow is a business center, and the one building is open 24hrs, so we start there and then open up the other places.

[BWhite]

I agree with Chuck .....6 hours is the longest time before I get calls from customers asking Where am I . Remember it will take another 6 and sometimes another 6 during a long deep storm

[JD PLOWER]

Commercial sites can often be pacified, as I said before by laying it all out for them long before the snow flies. As long as you meet their expectations, then both parties are happy.
For instance, learing entrances, exit and laneways, loading docks, making a few passes in front of the buildings, clearing a portion of the lot, etc
Chuck around here thats known as "showing the flag" or "show them we didn't forget about 'em"

Your right about contractors not planning their route out at all. I just picked up a sizeable account due to a contractors attitude about timely snow removal. I would be leaving my accounts near this one in the morning (say 8-9am) and this place wasn't done or he would just be getting there :rolleyes:

It was an easy sell to the management after what I had seen all winter :cash

[Clean Cut Lawns]

thats guys thats what i was looking for!:headwall

[Chief Plow]

Depends on how many sub's I have out, but usually on a normal 3-6 inch event, probably about 3-4 hrs.

Thanks
Rick

[grasshopper]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Clean Cut Lawns
[B]grasshopper,

how do your customers deal w/ only getting done by noon? don't the leave in the morning?


The residential customers that are done towards noon are the ones that don't mind waiting until then, or don't have a car anyway, but just want the driveway done for visitors etc. They are usually older people. Also we don't get a whole lot of plowable storms here, maybe 10 a year, so we have to have a 10 hour route to make any money in the winter.

[Clean Cut Lawns]

we only get about 10 plowable events as well

[seasonscape]

Last year my route took me about 8 hours on average. Like always, I looked at records to see how long everything took, raised prices and got rid of PITA, slow paying, etc. customers hoping for quicker times and better service. IMO 8 hours IS a little too long, even for residential, since storms don't always end at 10 PM (wouldn't that be great?). During the President's day storm (we "only" got 18") I only had one unhappy customer which turned out to be BS. The customer was upset about the windrow from the road plow which was high. The rest of the drive only had about 3". I think she still thinks I gave her bad service since I didn't receive the contract back.

When the heavy snow comes, they would take 14 hours+ to get to those sites the first time!

You think that's bad. I gave a customer a price last year and he thought it was high. He then proceded to tell me about another contractor that told him his route takes 24 HOURS!!! Can you believe that?!?!?!?!

-Tim

[Arc Burn]

Last season a 4-6" snowfall would average 8 hrs but this year i have cut that in half.I know local contractors who are plowing for days after a 4-6" snowfall and i'm blown away that people would put up with that?

[BWhite]

I have a dozen or so older customers who dont need to get out right away . Even though I keep them clear it is nice to know I have the option to wait ....if I really need some sleep

[Chuck Smith]

Planning is definitely the key. I used to have some residential customers that would go to Florida for a month in the winter, and some that would leave in October, and return in April. Those could wait until the next day after a storm. I found that they got done if I was not behind on my route, because I was right there plowing other accounts. If I was behind, I took advantage and did them the next day when I was out doing touch ups.

Around here the elderly must be more panic stricken. They of all my residential customers (when I actually did residentials!) would complain the most. Their biggest fear is that the ambulance wouldn't be able to get into their drivway, or up to the house in an emergency. Even when I plowed them twice during a 12" storm, and they never had more than 3" of accumulation....

We all have sites that can wait, and it is fine if the customer knows that in advance..... What gets me is contractors that agree to a certain time frame, just to get an account, knowing damn well they will never get it done as agreed....

~Chuck

[BWhite]

Thats why I have them in the regular rotation . I am sure they wouild be panic stricken if I wasnt there soon even thought they say they are in no hurry . If i ever needed the time I would have the option of reminding them what they told me .

[T-Zab]

I sub for a local contractor and our average time is 6-7 hours. They do have a management plan for early am snowfalls. We do not do residential so we have no homeowners to deal with. First and formost is safety, for employees of the buisness's and general public. when buisness's are open we attempt to do very little backing up. I know this sounds crazy, but I live and plow in an area were there is tons of traffic and congestion. People dont care if your working or not and they will walk and drive right up your you know what. Most trucks plow to a stacking site and loop around to let the loaders take care of stacking or moving snow.
Most people will stay out of the way of a loader with a 16' pusher on it. :D
T

[GeoffD]

In terms of road plowing i believe MDOT recomends no longer than 2.5 hours to complete a route once. However many towns have routes 3.5 to 4.5 hours long to complete once.

Geoff

[YAKO]

this year we are aiming for 6-7 hrs per truck in the average snowstorm. if its a big storm were planning on up to 12-14. which will only happen once or twice most likely.

[AndyN.]

I will still go out at 2am and start my route. Plow (if necessary) and salt (on the heavy side). After I finished my route, I will go back and do whatever is necessary to have a complete melt for the remainder of the business day. My customers have no problem paying twice for one snowfall. They know that up front. In fact, I love it when it snows say from 10-12pm and then starts back up once I have started my route. Usually it means more visits.

[John DiMartino]

Clean cut,great thread!!. I usually have an extra truck for those occasions snd an extra driver,that extra truck can really help out. I also go out at 330am no matter what,even if it stil sonow,get the majority of the work done then finish the rest after the storm,you will sabe time that way,and if you leave that lot,there wont be much accumulation between 330 and 5am,you can usually lay some salt after you plow at 330,and that will keep new accumulations to a minimum ,so you can move on to your next accounts.

[W-n-K Landscaping]

I also start out at about 2:30-3am I try to hit all my residential accoutns, then head towards my commercials- they line up perfectly I have one that has to be done by 6am, one by 8 am, and one by 10am- each one only takes me 30-40 mins to do. One is seasonal, but the other two are per push, and if I have to go back they are fine with it- after all, we are located in lake effect land, so multiple pushes in a day is all part of doing business for them. Plus since one is a gas station, they like to be kept open since they are usually quite busy during a storm anyway! The other thing I did is on my one seasonal account- they pay per application of salt, and they want me to be very liberal with it as well!! so that works out in my favor as well!!

Man I love living in the Lake effect zone!!!

Bill

[Clean Cut Lawns]

cnypropertysvcs: lake effect zone.

hey john lets get together and make a lake so we can get in on that!

[W-n-K Landscaping]

You need a lake the size of Ontario to make it work!!!

LOL!!!

Bill

[Clean Cut Lawns]

i know.....
we should get started if want want it to work this year

[Dan725]

Great thread!

[drobson]

Last year an average storm took me 10 hours or so. This year I'm projecting 7 hours. I discontinued some clients that were too far out of my route and took too long to do. Hopefully, my average $$/hour will go up considerable this year from last.

[Got Snow?]

not that there's not enough responses, i'll chime in and say that 4-6 hours is the average "cycle time" for us 7" or less (40-50 res, 2-3 trucks) and yes this particular topic is one that will challange your time/business managment skills. (in fact i bet this is where a lot of companies "make it or break it")

i find if you start a little early it helps cushion the last people on your route. you can alway go back and replow (for free?) at your discresion. another technique is to "rotate" your plow list so clients aren't always at the end of the list all season. also, i f i don't have the man power available, i will return to do any shoveling thats required.

my contract states "timely" service- how ever i give no specific time frame.

[PSDF350]

Originally posted by GeoffD
In terms of road plowing i believe MDOT recomends no longer than 2.5 hours to complete a route once. However many towns have routes 3.5 to 4.5 hours long to complete once.

Geoff
wish my state/town was on that kind of schedual:mad: most times my section of rt119 is lucky to get done in 8hrs:mad: :mad: i believe its gone as much as 12-14hrs. 1' on road but 1.5 miles to the west of my house you cross rt32 its clear 7miles to the east you cross rt12 its clear.:headwall