Trackless tractor questions [Archive] - Snowplowing-Contractors.com

chtucker

05-18-2008, 01:11 PM

Who here is an expert besides Bill?

After considering my options/business for next season I am leaning towards concentrating on driveways only. Can be done before and after I head to work for the "man"

I have been shopping skid steers/compact tractors/building a driveway rig/buying a new truck.

Truck requires insurance and registration year round (about $2200 a year), tractor can be driven on street here, no registration or tags needed.

Compact tractors in my Hp range and with a cab are over 30k, as are skid steers, both with a low transport speed.

I will not be doing any ice melt.

Building something would sure be fund, but, when I contemplate what I would need, what I would want, a Trackless with its small diesel/Dana 60s and the capability to run a blower up front make sense.

I have seen a few searching on the web, but nothing too close yet. I don't want to spend 2-3k to ship a machine that only costs 15-20k, sight unseen.

What are the differences between the MT3/MT4/MT5?

I know some of the differences are the hp of the Cummins at some point it went from 79hp to 110hp?

Did the all use the same hydro stat transmission? Eaton 33?

How expensive is a rebuild?

Did the transmission drive a mechanical transfer-case? Is the low gear transfer case neccessary for running a snowblower?

Are the body panels exchangable year to year. Alot of the machines look to have boogered fenders from tire chains.

Looks like easy to take care of? What kind of limited slips came with them? Is it worth rebuilding the diffs or sticking in a locker?

Anybody direct me to a under 20k machine that is diesel, lower hours, no rust?

szorno

05-19-2008, 11:16 AM

Howard,
this makes for some interesting pondering over lunch...:popcorn2 I have long thought about building a driveway rig. Here is what I would do:
Start with a 2002 Dodge 1500 short box w/ 360 V8 and Auto.
Pull the axles & springs out and replace with 2500 parts.
Then get a Boss 8'2" V plow for the front and a Snowman pull plow for the back. Set it up with tall mud type tires but sipe them so they are not scary on packed snow. Add a good set of rear facing flood lights and a simple light bar and there ya go. Short box 3/4 T snow pushing monster.
The beauty is that you can back up to the garage and drag out better than back-dragging. Back into your clear spot. Then go forward out. The mud tire would help in the deep snow. With weight on both the front & back you should be able to go thru really deep stuff without too much problem. No turn around needed to slow you down. The "art" would be backing into some of the drivewways you and I have to do. :rolleyes:

cat320

05-19-2008, 01:19 PM

http://pronovost.qc.ca/images/videopxpl.jpg

this is the best set up for drives ways but it's more than 30K

northernplowboy

05-19-2008, 07:40 PM

There is also a mining equipment company called Maclean Engineering in Ontario, Canada who have began production of a new sidewalk machine. It is bascially a copy of a Holder machine but looks meaner and comes with CAT power. I seen one sweeping streets a few weeks back and it looked impressive.

nsmilligan

05-20-2008, 11:55 AM

Howard to answer your questions as best I can.

The MT3 was the earliest version, Ford 4 cyl diesel, very crude just above a homebuilt. MT4 was a little better built, I think some also had the Ford engine, Not sure if they switched to Cummins until the MT5. 1st MT5 had non-turbo Cummins, and there have been many upgrades over the years, from windows to engine panels, and center section pins.
I believe the Eaton unit is still the same, never had to rebuild 1, but usually they are not crazy, just seals.
The hydrostatic motor drives thru a mechanical transfer case, with low neutral and high range, there is also a super low range optional transfer case which is an add on, no need for it for blowing snow, used mainly with a cold planning attachment.
Body panels changed a few times on the MT5, but rear fenders are the same, it would be cheaper to have a set made then buying from Trackless. Front fenders are part of the cab, and can be staightened. They usually get bend up from hitting poles and guy wires, cribbing and armco!!
They have standard Dana limited slips, same as Dodge, Lockers are now an option from the factory.
The Center section is one area to check carefully, worn pins about $1000 to replace, new center section about 2-3K, if these weren't greased on a regular basis (every 8 hours!) they usually need replacing.
Check for signs of leakage on the hydraulic oil cooler, these rust out in 3-5 years ($1000).

Rust is a big problem, as usually they are used in the worst conditions, and Trackless didn't have a great paint system till they upgraded their process about 2 years ago.

Got your PM, if I can answer any more questions give me a call.

Bill

mazamarick

05-22-2008, 09:54 AM

I bought two used MT5's last year and was generally happy with the overall performance, especially with the blowers that came with them. For negatives, I haven't driven a Holder, so I can't compare, but the Trackless are much less maneuverable than our Carraro's, and the visibility stinks. They're basically worthless without chains and not having lockers is a huge disadvantage. That said, the extra horse power 110 versus 74 on the Carraro's, makes a difference especially in heavy, wet snow. Parts are also cheaper and can usually be sourced locally versus the European machines.

There are some floating around for under $20K, but they tend to have a ton of rust or other serious issues. I can get you some contact names, if you're interested.

nsmilligan

05-23-2008, 04:41 AM

I run loaded studded tires on my Trackless plus wheel weights on the front, made a big difference for a couple of 100$ investment.
The one thing I didn't like was the performance of the Trackless blower, sold mine and bought a Normand with full flight augers, it will easily put double the snow through compared to the Trackless blower. http://www.cienormand.com/anglais/snowblower_sidewalk_normand.htm

Bill

mazamarick

05-23-2008, 08:52 PM

I had the same comments from the guys I bought my Trackless machines from, their blowers were ineffective and prone to clogging. I ended up with two different blowers- a Pronovost and Snowquip XX. For the money, the Pronovost is the better of the two, however the XX worked great on cutting berms and hard snow, it's just significantly more money compared to the Pronovost. Both blowers worked great and convinced me to buy another one when time comes to replace my older Loftness blowers.

Regarding the Loftness blowers- I bought two Loftness 721S blowers a year ago to augment the 4 I already had and what a mistake! We burned up both gear boxes on the two new blowers causing significant down time. What crap! The chute steel fatigued and cracked within a few months of use and had to be reinforced with some timely welds. The only reason I bought Loftness in the first place was because the older models were dependable and well made. Another off-shore, cost cutting measure gone awry. Never again!:mad:

dumptrucker

05-26-2008, 08:43 PM

Try h.p. fairfield in Morrisville VT. They are a trackless dealer. Our town will be trading a year 2001 in. They gave us 20 grand for it. It has a new motor in it , only about 1500 hours on it. We have never had a problem with the trackless blowers, the biggest thing with them is if you change a chain or something else that you retime the augers. If you don't it does make a world of difference in the performance.

chtucker

05-26-2008, 08:52 PM

Very interesting. Bill from Snoquip stated he was headed back east to look at 2001, 2002, 2003 that are being traded in. The 2001 had 1475 hours on it.

What kind of shape was it in?

We will see what Bill comes back with a price????

I would be willing to bet money it is the same machine.

chtucker

07-07-2008, 06:16 AM

http://cgi.ebay.com/MT-Trackless-Municipal-Tractor-Snowblower-plow_W0QQitemZ220254294970QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item 220254294970&_trksid=p3286.m14.l1318

Would any of you buy this????

http://i19.ebayimg.com/05/i/000/fc/28/88fc_1.JPG

nsmilligan

07-07-2008, 06:27 AM

Looks pretty rough to me. Series IV, pretty old. I think it would have the Ford engine, but I haven't seen one with the exhaust coming out the side. Trackless blower, but looks like a converted Meyers plow.
I think I'll pass!:rolleyes:

Bill

Mark Oomkes

07-07-2008, 08:07 AM

Howard, how serious are you? Fred's favorite FORMER Blizzard dealer has a used one, don't remember all the details, but I'll find out more if you want.

nsmilligan

07-14-2008, 06:17 AM

Trackless has come out with the series 6. http://www.tracklessvehicles.com/tractor.htm

Certainly looks more operator friendly, plus fuel savings of 1 to 1.5 gallons/hour.

Bill

MCV

07-14-2008, 01:37 PM

Now that's a nice looking machine!

synner

07-14-2008, 05:56 PM

Trackless are built about 40 minutes from me in a town called Courtland. Almost all of the muni in and around Ontario have some or a full fleet of these machines. The biggest complaints I hear is the interior cab noise and that they are prone to major hydraulic leaks/failures in the mid region of the machine.

They seem to hold lots of value at the local equipment auctions each year.

MCV

07-15-2008, 05:14 AM

Around my place they seem to get stuck alot.

But frankly I think it's mostly lack of operator skill. Also seeing them slam into a curb not knowing it was there looks pretty painful. :D

nsmilligan

07-15-2008, 10:43 AM

The Trackless comes stock with skid steer 16.5" tires which are almost useless as snow tires. Most Towns and municipal units won't budget for snow tires for them!!:huh With a decent set of snow tires or chains they are pretty good.
Never heard of the hydraulic leak problem as there is nothing in the mid section to leak except for hoses, but the hose ends are prone to rust if not cared for.
The tractors owned by some municipal units take more of as beating from lack of maintenance then anything else.

Bill

dvxfrd

09-01-2008, 07:26 AM

New to forums in general and to this site, patience appreciated>

Looking for any info on tires for Trackless. I own two machines (MT-3 and MT-5) with different set ups on each. On the 3 I have Goodyear Terra Grip which I use with chains that do well on the gravel drives with some grade. The 5 has some standard light truck, mud/snow tires that work o/k on flat pavement but are terrible on the loose hills. Wood like to find some terras for the 5 but have had no luck finding in the 16.5 in. rims.

Any input or advice would be greatly appreciated.

nsmilligan

09-01-2008, 09:52 AM

The 5 uses Dana axles the same bolt pattern as Dodge/GM 3/4 tons. I'd find a set of used Dodge 2500 8 bolt 16" rims, they're usually pretty reasonable at scrap yards and put what ever tire you like on it. 235/85/16 LT studded snow tires are what I use for winter, but they don't leave enough room for chains.

Bill
PS Not all GM 8 bolts will work, the center hole is too small, make sure you check if they will fit over the axle hub.

trackless

11-13-2008, 10:41 AM

This isn't meant to be a plug for Trackless but I did want to comment on some of the things I've read throughout the forums.

We're getting very positive feedback on the MT6. Demo machines aren't even making it back to the factory and we're booking into spring at this point...

A ton of improvements went into the MT6... mostly from customer feedback. Joystick for hydraulics, more glass/visibility, quiter engine for decreased noise and vibration, electronic foot pedal, Work Mode/Travel Mode (for fuel efficency), the list goes on. This all contributes to the cost and hence the price of the unit... but it was asked for by customers. One thing to note about Travel Mode: Fuel Tests indicate a savings of $30K - $48K in fuel cost over an average 12-year life cycle of the unit... if that helps the sticker shock at all.

Parts pricing is being addressed both internally and with our dealers. Lots of parts have been marked down considerably. Although we set an MSRP for parts, dealers set their own prices which quite often includes shipping. We encourage dealers to carry common seasonal stock items to decrease shipping costs but our efforts end at the dealer.

I was surprised to hear that spare parts availability was an issue since our facility carries an unprecedented inventory of spare parts. I'd wager that 90% of spare parts orders get shipped the same day they're submitted. Again, this could be where a small dealer inventory would benefit in both cost and lead time.

If you have feedback for us, please email us at info@tracklessvehicles.com and you can go to http://www.tracklessvehicles.com for more info on the MT6.

I'm going to go back to perusing comments now...

chtucker

11-13-2008, 01:51 PM

The dealer in Colorado is not the best at communication.

Heck, every time the salesperson leaves me a voice mail he forgets to leave his number.:popcorn2

nsmilligan

11-14-2008, 03:16 PM

Trackless, glad to have you here.
I agree, with you on parts supply almost always next day.

Some things I changed on my Series V, and I hope you were able to add to the VI.
Intermittent wipers, a simple upgrade to the intermittent cole hersee switch.
A tool box, I added a Case unit that removes with a pin, I don't think the Series VI has one either:eek: Blowing snow means replacing shear bolts, you need spanners and a supply of bolts for both auger and PTO shaft.
Grease gun mount, I added one just inside the door, the center section is greased after every shift, 1 reason in 5 years mine still has the original pins!
Heated wiper blade, Everblades supplied 1 to me that has lasted 3 seasons, a must have when blowing snow.
Replaced the original Donaldson prefilter with a Donaldson Top Spin prefilter, no more clogging with snow when blowing.
Moved the hydraulic couplers for the salt spreader to the inside of the frame, and out of the spray from the rear wheels, quick couplers now last a couple of seasons.
Added back up lights to the rear of the salt spreader, thru a relay from the back up alarm comes on in reverse, much improved over the rear work light.
I do know you finally added a cup holder, now if TIM's would just come up with a really spill proof take out cup!:grinz

Bill

stargazer

11-14-2008, 03:55 PM

trackless

11-19-2008, 07:21 AM

Thanks for the welcome Bill. I'll certainly pass your mods onto engineering but can't guarantee anything. I have very little influence on the unit since I'm just in IT. I peeked out on the assembly line and I believe the intermittent wiper hasn't been updated nor have the rear couplers been moved. The other mods you mentioned are just that... mods. I wouldn't hold my breath...

Good luck this winter and may your equipment stay healthy!

trackless

11-19-2008, 07:26 AM

chtucker,

If your dealer isn't responding in a timely manner, I'd suggest you submit a request to our online contact form and comment that your dealer needs a push. That way, our sales staff will be informed of any issues and keep on top of the dealer to follow up.

TahoeWorkz

01-24-2009, 03:08 PM

Just chiming in to say that I love my Trackless MT5s. We are at high elevation here at Lake Tahoe and the turbo model is a must for the deep snow. Our first model was a used MT3 and that didn't make it through the first season. We are running Snoquip XX blowers on the MT5s.

http://tahoeworkz.com/extra_footage/TahoeWorkz01.jpg

http://tahoeworkz.com/extra_footage/TahoeWorkz02.jpg

http://tahoeworkz.com/extra_footage/TahoeWorkz03.jpg

T-Zab

01-24-2009, 03:22 PM

Sweet pics Jeff, how long did it take to open that one up ?
How come you guys dont just blow all the snow in the road LOL ?
Seems lot sof homeowners do that here with there blowers, never could figure that one out for the life of me :rolleyes:

Welcome to the site !

TahoeWorkz

01-24-2009, 03:48 PM

Z-Tab-

The drive took probably 10 minutes to blow. A bit more than that each way in travel time even though the machine gets up to about 24MPH. Took me the most time getting out to take pictures. I needed to grab that moment though. It was worth it. Just wish there was someone there to get the action shot instead of the unmanned machine.

I don't like to blow into the road- but I was thinking about throwing the snow one driveway over each time. Could be a good retirement job, just can't get caught! And yes, majority of homeowners throw into the roads here too even though it is illegal. I especially hate it because the Trackless has no suspension besides the air ride seat so hitting that dense snow throws the attachment all around and can get us out of control. I think they are trying to keep their banks down so they will be able to continue to throw the snow all year long. The good County drivers will push it right back to them.

chtucker

01-24-2009, 03:50 PM

How is Bill at Snoquip? I have been talking to him about coming out to Colorado

TahoeWorkz

01-24-2009, 04:00 PM

Bills doing just fine as usual. They are developing their XX blower and placing orders in many corners of the world. It's a great compliment to the Trackless. I built the Snoquip.com website for Bill a few years ago. And now Trackless has designed the MT6 so I'm hoping we'll be doing some updating soon. Winter in our area has been very slow this season so I'm not sure if that affecting their business or not. We need snow!

snocrete

01-24-2009, 06:34 PM

TahoeWorkz

01-25-2009, 08:18 AM

that is a great set of pics......really really cool........and i never would have thought the trackless machines went that fast(24mph):eek:......that is screemin for something like that!!!!.....what kinda route do you run that thing on, res., com., or a mix?......welcome 2 LTS!!! ..........

Thank You for the welcome! Yes, the machine gets up and goes- even at our elevation 6250-7800 feet. Uphill can drag the hydraulic drive a bit. During storm conditions, the "mobile office" is one of the best ways to get around. Especially with the security of chains on all four. I'll take it to the store for a quick run when the roads are really bad. Have also pulled out so many banked cars and even fellow snow removal companies stuck in the snow with ease. It's funny but after doing a route all night in the Trackless, it's scary to get into the truck for a drive.

I run mostly residential accounts. I only do a few smaller commercial lots. I don't do too many HOA's either so I'm directly dealing with who I'm working for. Up to this season, I was a one man show clearing about 130 accounts (4-plex etc counts as 1). That would take me 6 hours if not dealing with the daylight shift. Timing is everything. Probably 9+ hours if during the wake time. We get a lot of tourists through our playground and they all like to stop and take photos of the machine so that adds quite a delay. Everything we clear is paved which makes a difference with a blower. This year we also added the second MT5. No real snow pack so far so our timing was a bit off. Also noticed quite a few drops from foreclosures I assume since we are in a resort (and second home) area. But all in all, can't complain. My snow removal business carries me all year round since I can take on so much volume. I like my time off. But I am debating installing a chipper and stump grinder on the machines this year to get them exercised a bit during the summer months. There is a bunch of defensible space work going on in the summer up here ever since the South Lake Tahoe fire we had a few years back.

MCV

01-25-2009, 04:03 PM

I've watched a few of your videos on YouTube. Awesome.

Snowboy

01-25-2009, 06:08 PM

There are a few for sale in the great white north here..

http://woodstock.kijiji.ca/c-cars-vehicles-other-TRACKLESS-SNOW-PLOW-W0QQAdIdZ94010735

http://www.trader.ca/search/Results.asp?BFROM=1&BAD=N&BPRICE=N&BTYPE=B&BCAT=8&BOREGION=-1&BYEAR1=&BYEAR2=&BPRICE1=&BPRICE2=&BKEYWORD=trackless&BMAKE=-1&BMODEL=&BMAKENAME=&category=8&region=-1&adcopy=trackless*&multiphoto=N&SortBy=askprice&SortOrder=d&DisplayType=&DisplayRowCount=&mknm=-1&mdnm=&subcategory=-1&CAT=8

Dave.

Mark Oomkes

01-26-2009, 04:21 AM

Welcome to LTS, Jeff.

Any snow this week? wasn't sure if they were predicting it in your area.

Nice machine and awesome videos. Amazes me how fast you got that driveway cleaned off.

PS We love pics of equipment as well as the scenery around you. Humor us flatlanders. :grinz

MCV

01-26-2009, 05:47 AM

They're definitely cool machines, but you know, I'm really not crazy about how much they bounce around when they lose traction....which actually seems more common than you would think/I would like.

Also, the articulated steering can be a bit of a hazard. I've seen operators try to maneuver around cars and 'wag the tail' almost hitting them. Scraping ability also seems terrible, but that might be operator error....I don't know.

I've never seen a Holder in use. Do they bounce around as much? I've seen that picture on here of a Holder with its front wheels off the ground so I imagine they can scrape pretty well...even though that operator sucks. :D

cat320

01-26-2009, 06:38 AM

Take a look at this machine Mark found the link to it but not any good pics

http://www.grouperpmtech.com/Cameleon_utility_vehicle_home.html

http://www.grouperpmtech.com/PDF%20brochures/Brochure%20Cameleon%20EN%202008-08.pdf

MCV

01-26-2009, 06:49 AM

From Quebec too, like these guys...

http://www.camoplast.com/en/track_machines/sw4s_intro.php

cat320

01-26-2009, 06:51 AM

the thing i found interesting is you could convert from track to wheels or vice versa wish there where better pics on there web site the cab looks pretty big.

nsmilligan

01-27-2009, 04:40 PM

Hi Jeff,

I have an MT5, Just wondering looking at the Snoquip site if you have the lift kit? What size tires are you running, the biggest I can fit are 235 85 16's studded. I looked into the snoquip blower but at 14 grand compared to 7500 for a Normand (http://www.cienormand.com/anglais/snowblower_sidewalk_normand.htm) not contest The Trackless blower sucks not blows:wink
Couple of easy mods especially if you running it around town, how about intermittent wipers? cost you about 70 bucks and 1/2 hour to install.
Have you had problems with the pre filter filling with snow when blowing change it to a Donaldson topspin about $70 and bolt on.
Also I have cross referenced most common parts ie u joints, belts drive shafts bearings to common #'s if you need # PM me most times napa prices are 1/4 of Trackless prices.

Bill

MacLean MV

02-04-2009, 10:08 AM

Hello All,

I thought I would take this opportunity to introduce you to the MacLean MV. The MV is a compact articulating tractor with a 127hp caterpillar diesel engine, spacious ergonomic cab, which is all carried by a robust frame and 8000lb outboard planetary axles.

Check out: http://www.macleanengineering.com/Products/MV/index.php for more information

or visit http://www.youtube.com/user/MacLeanEngineering to watch some videos of the MV in action.

http://www.letstalksnow.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=21442&stc=1&d=1233774406

http://www.letstalksnow.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=21439&stc=1&d=1233773803

chtucker

02-04-2009, 04:22 PM

Don't see any dealers ANYWHERE in the USA:rolleyes:

Holder C4.74

02-12-2009, 02:13 AM

You are right MCV some holder operater sucks ! :D

Yes you are right they can bounce around, but mostly it's because the owner don't know how heavy the eqipment in front is. It need's sometimes extra wight in the back.

If you want to know more about the holder pm me , i am addicted to holder. :p

hlntoiz

02-12-2009, 06:13 AM

One of the cities here has one and they do part of the sidewalks on one of my commerical props. He always leaves 2" of crap that turns to ice and I have to deal with later on. Must be the driver.

Holder C4.74

02-12-2009, 07:50 AM

I think it's like with every job, if the driver loves what he is doing and knows what he is doing the job will be done good. Ok, it is also a question of the equipment to, if it not fit to that holder it will not work right.

But anyway it's here the same. Maybe they are doing it on purpose, the company, that is doing the snow removal for the town here loves to push all the snow in the way that i have to clean. When they did it first i talked to them to stop it and i went angry, but now i am only thinking "childgarden".
But you are right it's boring.

nsmilligan

02-13-2009, 02:39 PM

Yes you are right they can bounce around, but mostly it's because the owner don't know how heavy the eqipment in front is. It need's sometimes extra wight in the back.
With my Trackless most of the bounce is from the 500kg of salt in the spreader, ( on back) usually causes the front wheels to leave the ground, even with loaded tires and front wheel weights! With my blower on the bounce is reduced, but what can you expect with NO suspension:rolleyes:

BIll