Best V Box

[cat320]

Ok this moring after sitting behind a new GMC 5500 with a v box on it got me thinking because it was hydraulic and last night seen a friend with a gas one on his F-450.

So with all those choices why choose one over the other saying money was no an issue.

[wyldman]

Personally I prefer hydraulic undertailgate units,but if I had to choose a V-box,it would have to be hydraulic.One with a screw type auger,instead of a drag chain.The hydraulic units will chew up and throw just about anything,and are virtually trouble free.

Second choice would be electric,just for the simplicity,and no messing with another engine.

[Pelican]

I've run both the hydraulic powered and pony motor, hydraulic is better by far! Much more reliable because connections are mechanical, not electrical.

My second choice would probably be electric. I've never run one, but they seem much simpler than gas powered units, only two wire connections rather tha 7 on a gas job.

[HerkFE]

1st choice hydraulic
2nd electric

Reasons: see above posts...hard to improve upon those.

[phillyplowking1]

I am really happy with my hydro undertailgate spreaders and v-boxes.
I am happy with my electric Smith V-box 2:D

[Lawngodfather]

Hydro, but I can convert my Gas to hydro very easy if I have central hydro in all the trucks.

Never used electric v box before.

[4evergreenlawns]

More importantly is what SIZE truck? I think that is the driving factor of what you mount to/on it.

P/U - never have seen central Hyds on on so your choice is limited. When I asked about Central Hyds on a F-350 dually I was given the "well I gues we could do that but, why again"??

Since money was not as important as the right truck for the job at the time I went with the F-450 with undertailgate and central hyd for spreader only. All in all I should have gone with the F550 but I let my insurance agent of all people talk me out of it due to the rates.

For a P/U I ran a electric V box but just the wrong one. I am running a gas V box now and I am already looking at replacing that with a dump insert and a tail gate electric set up. If not that a a SS Downeaster all electric. Gas just has too many issues with starting but the design is great.

As for the HYD V I would agree with Wyldman if I was to have a Hyd V it would be one with a screw down the middle. My under tail gate spreader eats and spit out every thing.

[Lawngodfather]

I heard the auger type v box spreaders jam more than the drag chain.

[Pelican]

P/U - never have seen central Hyds on on so your choice is limited

The under hood configuration of 3/4 ton pickups is identical to that of 1 ton dumps, so the same equipment could be used in either case. There are kits available for almost every vehicle, the reason you don't see them is due to expense. Cat has said money is no issue in his question.

[Lazer Man]

I have to go with hydraulic, then electric. We have 1 Stainless Steel Smith electric which is on my truck (love it) the other two trucks run Stainless Buyers with gas engines, a real pain in the, well you know what. Mine just hit the switch and I'm flowing the others sometimes they won't start especially with these cold temps lately.

Bob :grinz :grinz :burnout

[4evergreenlawns]

Pelican,

The issue was not the under the hood space but mounting the tank for the Hyd fluid. There is a great thread with a black Dodge truck and Central Hyds running two plows ( Blizzard and expandable rear plow) showing the tank in the bed. Although a hyd V box would fit in the bed you would have to contend with the tank in the bed whenever using it for anything else.

Even with money not being an issue the application should avail itself to reasonable thinking.

If that does not imply, I would like to vote for the new Escalde STX with a blizzard 8611 and a Hyd V box. Money not being an issue and all.

[Pelican]

Even with money not being an issue the application should avail itself to reasonable thinking.

A frame mounted tank under the bed with a fill tube would be unreasonable? Are there no farmers in Illinois?

[4evergreenlawns]

Steve,

Lots of farmers I am just not one of them. I am just talking about what I am seeing and what I have been told. As I mentioned I did look into doing HYD on a new F-350 Dually and was told by two upfit companies the tank was the issue. But what do I know.:headwall

I have never seen it but that does not mean it can not be done. Next time I see a farmer I will ask if he know what you were talking about. But I should also say that time will not be any time soon as I avoid the country unless it is going by at about 75MPH down the interstate. :burnout

Some day soon I will learn not to disagree with you, but than where is the fun in that..... :greenange

Hey did you see the pictures of my dump I finally get some posted. Did you say that you do or do not do salt with your F-350? I am taking one for a test drive for the day these week, 4x4 PSD of course. Any suggestions?

[Lawngodfather]

Our city guys here have the resevoir mounted on the back of the spreaders in the pick up trucks for their central hydro systems...

I am just not game to pay another $2000 on top of the price of the spreader only to run it and that's it.

Some of those city trucks have central hydro plows, some don't, but they all have the tank on back of the spreader.

BTW you have a tank on your truck as it is for the lift.

[4evergreenlawns]

LGF,

who you asking? and lifting what?

[4evergreenlawns]

LGF,

Both my plow and Dump body is elec/hyd, Central Hyds for Spreader only.

As I said before that is my choice for a few reasons. This set up outs great for my application. However, due to the electric draw I did have to change out the Alt. for a high out put 170APM. But the new F-350 will have dual alts and I would be strongly considering an electric option of some sort for slat spreading (NOT A VEE PRO).

Intested in a great deal on a Swenson 8' V 2 yrd. w/Honda engine Line-Xed hardly used this season???? Might even meet you half way:cash :cash

[Pelican]

No, I don't sand with my F-350.

I had a '97 F-350 dump with a Torwell gas powered V-box which I replaced with my F-550. The amount of time and blood (literally) I lost in keeping it running is what promted my response above. I allowed my dealer to talk me out of central hydraulics on that truck, a big mistake.

You mentioned you don't want levers in the cab as your reason for the electric plow and hoist. Are you aware there are solenoid activated valves available for that application? These only require a toggle switch to operate.

Blizzard also makes a version of their plow for use with central hydraulics that uses the identical controller as the electric version.

I don't care much for the pump redundancy that results from the use of electric pumps, especially if there is central hydraulics on board. I just like to think outside the bun!:beatsme

[GeoffD]

Fisher also sells a kit with there plows where you can use the fish stick with a central hydro system. All they do is pipe a hydro line into their valve block and your set.

Geoff

[cat320]

I can see that the most prefered would be the hydraulic and or the electric for the reason of working with no major problems.When i said" money is not an issue" would you put hydraulic into a smaller truck? Because as we all know money determines what we do and or what kind of truck we sometimes get .

[Pelican]

If money were no issue, I'd put central hydraulics in every truck I own. It's a very reliable manner of operation.

[wyldman]

The biggest problem with a hydraulic spreader is they require fairly high flow rates for proper operation.Most hydraulic pumps used for snowplows and dump bodies are usually too small for spreader operation,and a lot are electric,and no designed for continous operation.You need both more flow (GPM),and more reserve (bigger reservoir).

I would still put a good central hydro system in a small truck,if I was going to keep it long term.A lot of guys just lease and run the truck for a few years,then get another.In this case,it's not cost effective.Underhood packaging contraints also make it harder to put a big pump on some of the newer engines.

[Lawngodfather]

Originally posted by 4evergreenlawns
LGF,

who you asking? and lifting what? You. the hoist on your truck. I've seen tanks placed where your electric hoist is.

LIke Pelican said, they do have solenoid operated valves, I am going to use solenoids in this truck cause I don't want the plumbing in the cab.

Also the central hydraulics will also power the hoist.

[myoder]

LGF,
I like your new tandem axle configuration!:D What program did you use to do it

[4evergreenlawns]

Pelican and LGF you both have great points.

I did not know there was elec/switched that would operate the stuff running of HYD pump but as Chris mentioned the pump needs to be biggger and also does the tank. On something like a F-650 or bigger ALL Hyd would be the way to go no doubt. That would be assumeing you are running a huge operation where ther is a nice steady supply fo RPMs in long runs.

I think also as Chris stated due to the diffrence in GPM needed by either the plow of the salter, or the dump, in the smaller lot where the runs are short and application of power to the plow, spreader, or dump is short term with RPMs changing all the time it is just not a smooth operations. On the 450 PSD alone I had to rule out dual alts costing me to replace the OEM alt witha hug out put. When I bid the upfit to run everything on Hyds was going to be about 6500 just for the Hyds in stead of 2300. jus to run the spreader. Enve removing money from the deal I have run 450/550 dumps and a 350 with Hyd and on the roads it was great for running both at the same time, but in parking lots it just was a PITA when trying to move the plow while laying salt. The spinner chaning speed, auger dumping too much salt. plow too slow.

Again I think this is not something you can just apply a writen in stone answer when it comes to the Hyds. I would agree that Hyd is the most reliable and less amount of maintenace with one accecption, one belt goes you are left with nothing.

Although the same would apply to all electric batts dead you are stuck but so is the truck.

Just like with anything esle you have to get what meets the demand of the service you are providing and put your money where it will do the best for you now and in the future.

[Lawngodfather]

Remember that Dodge Ram you saw posted with the "solenoid valves" in the back of the bed?

That box contained all the valves for the entire system except for the Blizzards controls, but it does have a valve to shut the flow off to the Blizzard. That plow had a lot of fetures to it requiring lots of valves.

Now your truck has amble room to place them, a pickup does not with a normal pickup bed, hence the box in the bed of the truck.

Now the pump on that is about the size of an alt. and you have plenty of room yo mout it, cause there is a mounting kit just for your truck. Certfied Power has it for sure. Trust me I checked.

BTW the price for me was $113 more for the electric vrs the manual, and the bonus of less plumbing so it evened out.

A hydro system should hold about 1½ times the system flow in oil so for a 15 gpm pump you need a 25gal (they don't make a 23gal0 tank. Also for just the bed use you could of used a 10 gal normally and had a 15 or 20 gal mounted on your spreader for when you use it, then you don't have to carry it year round, and you hoist will not be using no where near the 15gpm of the pump.

As it stands though without getting into to much detail, you already have a system so lets not tread on what you could of gotten.......

BTW I think you can still incorparate your hoist into the spreader.

Also the guy from CP said to set the system up for low rpms so the truck can run the spreader on low rpms, not when you rev it up.

I will keep you all updated when I install mine in my 4700

[4evergreenlawns]

Well I will look into it some more for for the F-350 I am ordering this summer so thanks for the info.

[Lawngodfather]

To get the same system I was going to get minus the hose/plumbing was $13XX.

All solenoid valves...certified power

[GeoffD]

If the truck has an air system for either air over hydro breaks, or air breaks, there is another option. Air valves can be located outside of the cab area, while the air controll requires more space than electric it requires much less than cables. The advantage to air is a very reliable system, electric is reliable but exposure to salt, will cause problems overtime. The only thing that will really kill an air system is if the compressor dies, or a line fails. If the compressor goes down, you SOL anyways so no big deal. If a line breaks 9 times out of 10 it is a quick easy fix.

Geoff

[4evergreenlawns]

Ok, So when to my dealer today to pick up my 8' western with the new A frame and we got to talk about HYDS on P/U.

He best offer was, Central HYDS with the Electric valve controls and the Tank mounted to the rear of the spreader where the Gas engine would normally be. That way no tank to worry about under the bed once you have the spreader off is it easy to service from next season. Still can run Elec/hyd for the plow.

With this application I would be left with only one ALT. having to do the upgrade like I am doing in the F-450 for $400.00.

So money not being an issuse, yes HYDs is a very real possibility.

Money being an issue, just the Central Hyds install.. $4000.00 not including the V box. Add about 3000.00 for a SS two pump (spinner/conveyor) looking about over $7000.00 and that leaves the V box sitting 7-8 months out of the year doing nothing but taking up space.

For $7000.00 I can get a SS dump insert with a Spreader tailgate. Use the dump year round, tailgate can be removed by two people and keep in the shed. Less room for storage and my investment will tripple its return with increased usablilty and productivity. Moreover, it is all electric. Dual ALT from the factory one a $340. upgrade. Unless someone knows of a HYD dump insert with a HYD tailgate spreader.

[Bonzai]

I just read all these posts and i am shocked about how many do not like a gas engine on a V-Box salter. While I do understand that there is gas involved and they may not like the cold temps, I have never experienced any of these problems and these poor suckers put down 8 tons of salt each for each event..I run two of these V-Boxes and they have been great. Open the choke hit the button and thats it, I kid you not no problems and the oldest unit I have is 11 years old and is only on it`s second engine. I find them very easy to operate. I do have a hydraulic unit (homemade under tailgate unit) but find it a pain to always have to stop raise the box and fill the auger. That being said I would like to try the electric units if they are as good as every one says.I like are 3 Airflow tailgate units, work well and trouble free.

[Snowboy]

Ok I don’t know 1st hand seeing as I haven’t been in the business for myself but have worked for other for a few years and have heard the bitching and cursing.

Gas V box the Carb freezing up regularly and the Hydraulic under tailgate screw type auger the salt usually cakes onto the auger and I usually had to drive with one foot on the Gas and one on the brake and one hand on the wheel and one on the dump leaver in order to get a decent amount of salt out of it.


Looking to get into the Snow Works next year so I want to explore all my options but the Electric spreaders from Trynex look attractive.

[CT18fireman]

I would want the hydraulics to control all functions, plow dump body and spreader.

I would not want a pony motor for hydraulics.

[capnkel]

My vote would definitely be for central hydraulics.I have done a couple installs myself for a friend,one on a Chevy3500,and a Ford550,my 87 F250 has had a PTO driven pump on it from nearly the day i bought it,however the PTO setup is ok for what i use it for,a belt driven setup is much more versatile,with a little imagination ,it can be adapted to operate nearly anything,i have split dozens of cords of wood with my woodsplitter hooked into my trucks system,it was nearly twice as fast as it was operating off a 265 Massey Fergusson tractor,i have seen pics of one guy that mounted a backhoe to his truck.There is plenty of room between the frame rails and the box sides on a standard pickup to mount a hydraulic tank,you may need to have one custom built,as most upfitters commonly use off the shelf components,i made the tank on mine from 10"aluminum pipe,the only minor problem is filling it,but with a small marine type access plate fitted in the bed where the fill is,that problem is solved.I have done setups 3 different ways,valves in the cap,noisy,hard to route,takes up space.Cable controled levers,quiet,sligtly less space.And soleniod operated,tend to be less plumbing,as valves can be bolted to a common manifold,no cab noise from the fluid flow,very reliable if they are mounted in a protective box,very little space is used in the cab,basically just a few toggle switches and speed dials.

[Assured Services]

Snow Ex V 8500 just came out this year. Looked at one at the local dealer. Not too impresive. It's a poly v, but a painted black frame:eek: We see a few of them here as they are made in Warren, MI. Close to 5k for a two yard spreader that I don't know if it will work after the probs with the v8000.
Just have a hard time buying a v box by snow ex for a while.
Downeaster seems to know what is going on!
The dump inserts for the pick-ups seems to be a good idea too, like said less to store in the summer!