Production for this site

[cutntrim]

Hey all,

Haven't posted in quite a while. I've been asked to bid on a commercial plaza that's right near my house. The total area is 9.5 acres and of that, 6.5 acres are plowable. It's pretty much wide open with no islands and new asphalt. Having only ever plowed with pickups and a skidsteer, it would be the first time using a wheel loader for me. Looking at a 12' pusher box with a CAT 908.

Does anyone have a production rate for this sized combo? Or something similar you've used before? The Avalanche dealer (pusher boxes) figures 2.5hrs start-to-finish for 2". Contract is awarded September 1st.

[Mark Oomkes]

I am never good with the aerial pics, sorry. I need to see it in real life, 3-D.

I think the 2.5 hours is slightly optimistic, however. Even without a lot of obstacles, that's a lot of ground to cover. Not impossible, but unlikely IMO.

How long do you think with a truck? I used to be able to price jobs using a truck then actually clear it with a loader. Then a couple idiots have come along and decided they want to be the biggest and lowest priced contractors in GR and started pricing loaders at the same rate as trucks. While I know you can still make money this way, it's just a stupid way of pricing. I would take the truck times and cut it about in half--give or take a little. Afterall, if the loader goes down\doesn't show\whatever, you will be plowing it with a truck.

[Chuck Smith]

I'd be more worried about the loader breaking traction on those long pushes. I have found it is better to have a machine overrated for the size of pusher you have. Then they push like a dozer. I can tell you a 3 yard machine should have no trouble pushing a 16'. I had a site with a 16' loader model there, and no loader. The guy I had only had a backhoe, but he thought it would push it. I was very skeptical, he told me it was an old JD 710 2wd. I had never seen one before, so I met with him. HOLY COW that thing was HUGE. It made the Case 580 next to it look like a toy. While the pushes were not as long as the ones you have, he had no trouble at all.

I had a 16' loader model on an old Dresser 2 or 3 yard machine, and it pushed with no problems, and they were long pushes.

If you have traction problems on those long pushes, it will take you 5x longer to clear that site. A pre-app of de-icer will help a lot.

~Chuck

[cutntrim]

I've got a headache from crunching the numbers from every different angle but I'm probably going to go with 4 hours average time to clear the lot and that would be with the loader plus a bobcat for the curblines, along the walls, and sidewalks. There are a few other potential small sites nearby but nothing over 1 acre so this site's gotta pay for itself.

Being that the loader would be a rental and the dealer is 10min from the site, I hope that downtime won't be a big problem. That being said, if I put another machine on there I'll likely price myself out of the job.

So, Chuck, do you think the 908 is too small for a 12' loader? I specifically asked the equipment rental guys, the Avalanche Snowpusher sales guy (they're built in Oakville...next town over), and the Protech sales guy if a 2yd loader can handle it. They all think it can. The longest push would be 300ft.

[Mark Oomkes]

I think the 908 will be OK. Not the best, but it should work with the longest push only 300'. If you get heavier snows, you might need to work at it a little bit, but you should still get it done.

[John Banks]

I think the 908 will be OK. Not the best, but it should work with the longest push only 300'. If you get heavier snows, you might need to work at it a little bit, but you should still get it done.

ditto. the 908 is a 13k machine, should be ok with a 12' box

[cutntrim]

OK, good stuff. I can step up to the IT-14 (18,000lb) for another $900/mo. rental, but at $3,000 for the 908 I'll be forking out a pretty penny to begin with.

[John Banks]

OK, good stuff. I can step up to the IT-14 (18,000lb) for another $900/mo. rental, but at $3,000 for the 908 I'll be forking out a pretty penny to begin with.

Are those CDN rates$ What is that in US $?

[cutntrim]

Yep, $CDN. Actually our dollar is pretty close to the $US right now. I think it's around $0.95US. I guess $3,000/mo. is high compared to your rates?

[Chuck Smith]

I wasn't saying that it won't push it, just when there are longer pushes and deeper snow, or heavy wet snow, traction is a biggie. I know a lot of guys wait until the end to bring out the pushers. While many islands in a lot suck, some are nice to make for shorter pushes.

~Chuck

[cutntrim]

Sure, that makes sense. The plan would be to plow with the storm since the loader would be dedicated to the site.

[CGSI]

CutNtrim
We run a 12 foot box on a 4wd Backhoe 90 HP and 16K weight with good results on 700 foot pushes but as Chuck and the others have said make sure you do not let it get ahead of you

[itsgottobegreen]

I would try to find a sub who already ownd a 1.5 yard or better wheel loader. Then there is no expensive rental fee.