Moss has got to go !

[Plow Dak]

Hey Everyone.
I need some real world advise.
I have moss growing in various places on my lawn.
One section is like 30' X20' and have some around the foundation.

I have been told all sorts of things from using soap /water mix to scraping the top layer off and reloaming and seeding.

Lawn care is not my best friend but this years weather has made me have to do something. I need to scrape a few dead sections and loam and seed also so while i'm at it i want to tackle this Moss thing.

And after i'm done is there anything to keep this crap from coming back ???

Thanks in advance.

[MDsnowPRO]

Have you tried Lime? Raising the soil pH with agricultural or dolomitic lime may help the problem. 20-30 lbs per 1000 sq ft. Also is the area shady? Prunning limbs so air can move through and sunlight can reach the turf. Different moss "control" products are out there too and they work pretty well too, they can be found at a garden center or home depot type store.

[atgreene]

He's right Mike. Dump all the lime you can on it, when you think you've put enough, dump some more. The acid soil around here and pine tree's really raise heck with soil ph. My father always said about hay fields, you can put enough lime.

BTW, hydrated lime will work fast, but becareful, you CAN put too much of that on. Pellitized is slow to disolve, so try to use a mix, but primarily pulverized.

[Plow Dak]

OK stupid question NO 2.

When i spread out this lime what will be the result ??
I.E.
Will the moss dissolve and grass magicly appear???
Will It just go to bare ground and reseeding be necessary??

How fast does this proccess take. Like will it take a few years to take care of this or do i need to do something during this process..???

Or should I just skim the top layer off and throw some loam down and reseed now ??

[BWhite]

Thanks for asking this question Mike and thanks for the info guys !!!! I will start to hammer my lawn with lime . At least that area . I will use what I always use on the rest .

[atgreene]

It will take a year or so to really turn it around. I generally reseed as needed, where the grass doesn't fill in.

For 10 years now, I have spread a pallet (2400 lbs.) on my 4 acre field, and it still needs lime. It takes time to break down, so a light dose of hydrated lime followed by copious amounts of pulverized is your best bet.

[MDsnowPRO]

The lime can improve availability of nutrients and supply calcium and thus helping the turf grow better, but will not kill moss directly. I went out and looked at what i use before lime. its called LESCO Moss and Algae Eraser. Apply this and wait for the die off then you need to rake the dead moss off or "de-thatch" and then top-dress with soil and seed the bare spots. Make sure you water until the new grass is established.

Lime only will take a while but its a good idea to lime every other year or so and this will keep the moss from coming back

[Plow Dak]

I'm taking lots of notes LOL

Thanks guys.... this helps greatly

[atgreene]

Mike, btw, be careful with hydrated lime if you go that route. Wear gloves, don't stir it up. It tends to do bad things to skin.:wink

[Plow Dak]

Hey Alan

You really think lime would make a difference in MY SKIN LOL

Thanks.. ;)

[Rocket]

There are different limes (limestone). Only a soil test is going to tell you which one you should use. Matter of fact you should be doing a test every two to three years anyway to determine which nutrients you need. I mean, why apply something you don't need? Contact your state extension to find out if they do the testing or whom they suggest. It costs very little, will save you money in the end, and you are already paying into the program with your tax dollars. No, the store tests do not cut it. Do it right. OK, back to the limestone. Basically the differences are in the Ca to Mg ratios. Here in the northeast we find the vast majority of properties we test have been treated with products having the wrong ratios (before we came along). Again, do it right. You'll save yourself a headache and possibly a weekend for fishing.

Limestone takes time to work. The finer the mesh (the screen which the limestone can flow through) the faster it will work, but it can take months to change the base pH (never mind the reserve). Look for a product where a majority will flow through a 100 mesh (149 microns) sieve. The pelletized products usually are 100 mesh, but glued together. Liquid lime is even faster than dried products.

Don't lime the shrubs and trees unless the soil test says you should. All plants are NOT created equal. Bringing your soil pH up to 7.0 (where most of our cool season grasses would prefer it) can wreak havoc on many shrubs and trees. Certain plants are adept at pulling nutrients from the soil at certain pH. Again, ask your extension agent (or other person in the know).

Moss will grow unless you address the cause. A low pH may help moss do well in an area (then again we've grown moss in 7.0+ pH soils) but also look to these other causes. 1) Water/poor drainage: are there places that puddle or tend to keep moist after watering or a rain storm more than others? Do you water too frequently or at inappropriate times of the day? Moisture in itself is a great way to start algae and moss in a lawn and it also leads to 2) Compaction: got kids playing soccer on the lawn? Parking trucks and plows out there? Overwatering? Moss likes the compacted soil in the 3) Shade: Is it the north side of the house? How about trees? Pruning trees so you get at least dappled sun on the grass will help the grass grow. Those bags of "shade grasses" refers to shade tolerance, not that they will thrive there. They still need sun. If it is a house then you might have to rethink what you want to be there. 4) Moss nearby: moss is spread by spores. They are a weird sort of plant, thing, species, stuff. They don't have roots like other forbs or herbs. They like conditions as mentioned above (where other plants fear to thrive). They fill a niche. If there is plenty of moss growing say in nearby woods or an the neighbors property then you may have a continuous infestation.

Moss is becoming popular. Check out the prices for a shipment of it and you might think you should go into business if you have enough. People are turning their lawns over to it all the time. It is green, low to no maintenance, and feels great under foot. Now, if you have dogs or other pets, kids (or other pets), the local H.O.G. hanging out on your lawn then it ain't gonna do to well. Get rid of it with chem.s or a flat shovel works fine and plant the appropriate grass seed at the appropriate time.

[GMC Driver]

Mike,

I didn' t see this until just now - but alot of good advice dispensed. We always recommend the lime applications to help eradicate moss - I've even learned a few more things from this thread. Thanks Don!

[hlntoiz]

Lime will certainly help but you really need some sun, so cut the trees down! Sorry that is the french in me. Then lime the crap out of it, recondition (harley rake) and seed. You can never over lime a lawn!

Just my $.02:p

[atgreene]

Rocket, I don't think Mike needs a soils test unless he wants a putting green. This is Maine, everything is acidic. I think he'll find that a little lime will turn things around for him. It doesn't matter what he does, until the ph changes, he won't grow any grass.

[apgarconstruction]

I have the same problem on my lawn, towards the front. it's better than it was, but i have too many trees running along the road and a small patch of woods in the upper corner of the property near the road that is too big to really cut down and i like the privacy. i had the whole front lawn regraded last year and a swale cut into it for drainage. i had all new topsoil brought in, raked and seeded it. grass grew in ok, but not ok in spots. i have to put some more soil down because I think with the york rake, i took too much off in spots. was using a friends york rake and it didn't have a wheel.
I noticed this year that the shaded areas where I reseeded the moss is growing back. i hate it because the zero turn just peels it up too fast and that area stays wetter longer. we have a lot of clay and rock in my area so it takes a while to dry out.
I wish I had a nice harley rake and a tractor to pull it but i'm not in the green industry and have a hard time justifying buying one just for this. have to see if I know someone with a harley rake. the thing that got me was when the dozer got done spreading the top soil, it looked great. and then we had a rain storm and it started washing and hardening the stuff before i could even get on it to rake it. or i would ahve done it all by hand. it's a pretty big area but would ahve been easy when the soil was freshly graded. the rain screwed it up bad. by the time it dried for me to get on it, it was hard as a rock and needed the york rake. :( i have 3 acres of all grass just about and really like my lawn to be nice but it's almost too big to get into reseeding the whole thing. there are different kinds of grass all throughout the lawn and i would love it to be all the same grass and smoothed out. i just don't want the expense of having the whole thing scraped, smoothed and reseeded. no time to do that either. is there any other way to reseed and get the grass to all look the same, i think this lawn was a field at one time and so it was never really planted or seeded properly like a brand new house would be.

[Mark Oomkes]

I'll second what Don stated. Regarding the soil test, it may not be necessary, but does your doctor start prescribing meds without a blood test?

I'm going to really recommend the aeration as well in addition to trying to get some light and air flow, but aeration will probably do just as much as lime, I'd bet anyways. What type of soil do you have? Rocky? Clay?

[Alan]

I'll second what Don stated. Regarding the soil test, it may not be necessary, but does your doctor start prescribing meds without a blood test?

I'm going to really recommend the aeration as well in addition to trying to get some light and air flow, but aeration will probably do just as much as lime, I'd bet anyways. What type of soil do you have? Rocky? Clay?

Mark, the whole of southern Maine is barely one step removed from sandblow country. The soil has a reddish cast to it and looks ot be a fine sand that I suspect is decomposed granite, courtesy of the Ice Age. Even the rocks have a reddish brown tint and contain a lot of tiny quartz inclusions. It tends to support a lot of scrub pine growth, conifers prefer acidic soils. Main problem is getting enough moisture retention to support decent turf.

We get some of the same sandy conditions here, except that ours tend to be localized with the rest being rock strewn clays. "Glacial till" seems to be the term I've heard used for the stuff that isn't sandy. It's pretty much standard practice to dose it good with lime, then get a test a year later. By then the lime has had a chance to work and bring things a little closer to correct ph.

[apgarconstruction]

Alan,

what's this ICE AGE You speak of? you mean to tell me the earth was one time covered in all ICE and it Naturally warmed itself without mankind on it, and ice melted? oh man, I better get ALGORE on the phone and let him know about this one.

LMAO

what a bunch of morons we have in hollywood and washington.

sorry to get off topic. on to MOSS TALK................

[Chuck Smith]

Dan you should aerate too after grading with a dozer and running a york rake on the lawn.

~Chuck

[apgarconstruction]

I'll check into that chuck. i gotta rent one i guess, but i need a small tractor to pull it with. i'm keeping my eyes out for a use small tractor with bucket but man, they are way over priced imo. even for kubotas that are 15 years old they want like 8k or higher for small tractors.

[GMC Driver]

Have any of you heard of spreading gypsum on heavy clay soils to help break the soil up, making it more permeable for water and fertilizers?

This was a reccomendation I recieved from an interesting source, just wanted to check the validity of it.

[Mark Oomkes]

Have any of you heard of spreading gypsum on heavy clay soils to help break the soil up, making it more permeable for water and fertilizers?

This was a reccomendation I recieved from an interesting source, just wanted to check the validity of it.

I have heard of it Dave, never tried it though. The biggest problem with most or all soil amendments is it takes a lot of time and material. It is generally not a 1 time thing. Still trying to find a way of amending soils with compost that is cost effective. The best thing we have found so far is aeration and last year we started using Nature Safe ferts at a few customers to see what the results are. So far, so good. In fact, the results have been awesome so far. The only downside is the stuff is very dusty.

[2_DJinn]

1. Take a soil sample to Lesco

2. Hope that your lesco dealer is as good as ours.

3. If one and 2 doesnt work give me a call.


Ive learned that a soil sample is such a easy thing to do that I feel as if im cutting a big corner when it is not done. Guees im not as good as alot of guys to diagnose a turf problem over the net ...lol

Just my .02 and if ya dont like like it then Lime the hell outa her ..lol

[Plow Dak]

Well after my other project was completed i decised to tackle the moss a little .

I went with 2_Djinn's advice

"Just my .02 and if ya dont like like it then Lime the hell outa her ..lol"

So I did.

Do you think I used enough Nick ????

[atgreene]

Nope, better do another application.:D

[Crash935]

Yeah mike, think your still alittle short on the lime, but you DONT have to do the driveway or the roof of the house!