2nd BUYERS speed controller SMOKED

[4evergreenlawns]

:feedback


I am runing the new digital Buyers speed controller and in the last couple of event two of them have went up in smoke

Upon close inspection they both had the same exact failure in two different trucks. Plastic isolation bushing on very small screw seems to have melted after the board overheats causing a direct short, leading to some smoke out of the unit and it is done after that. I will get some pics of the failure in a day of two.

I have two questions:

1) Has anyone else had this happen?

2) It there anyone else making a variable speed controler for spinner motors??



My next step is to just wire in a on/off switch. In most cases the varibale speed is hardly being used any more. Myself and the otehr driver have just learned to position the truck where we need to be to get the salt where we want it. Over time it is much easier than have to adjust the speed for a small pattern and than turning it back up and so on.

If I do hard wire a on/off I will also add an in line braker maybe even salvage the one with the reset out of the two smoked Buyers units I have sitting here.

I am giving them on more try and if a third one smokes I will have to come up with a new plan of action to keep mt spreaders working.

Thanks

[snowjoker]

What spreader are ya running? If its a single stage any spreader controller will work. Is there any way to contact buyers and see what they will do about the problem?

[wyldman]

Ron - I think the motors you are controlling draw too much for the buyers unit.

I think this is what you want,it seems like a great unit.Available in single or dual motor control.

Omega variable speed controllers (http://www.karrierco.com/cgi-bin/shopper.exe?search=action&keywords=Omega)

[4evergreenlawns]

Chris,

As you are now a Downeaster dealer you know what I am talking about. On the tailgate spreader for the dump insert I run the Auger on one switch with the Silonoid and 40AMP in line breaker directly from the battery.

The speed controller is for the Spinner motor only. If I remember correctly the Auger is like 39 AMP and the spinner like 20 something.

The way I run the unit is I usually just turn in the spinner controller and leave it running than when I want salt it turn the auger on/off. As you know I own two of these because I have been some happy with the over all performance and the problem I am having it NOT a Downeaster issue.

I will take a look at the link and let you know. I have not forgetten about the Blizzard stops.

THANK YOU!

[4evergreenlawns]

Chris,

After looking over the link I really became interested in the Omega Twin Controller.

I called Karrier and spoke to Bob who was just a great guy to talk with. He took the time to really explain what the controller was capable of and how it would oprerate with the Downeaster set up I have.

Now I will tell you this is not a CHEAP venture by any means at $489.00 each (and I ordered TWO) but this controller seems like it is going to be a replacement for the plauged SnowEx VeePro controller. It is already the main controller with the Buyers Salt Dogg.

Although due to a current lack of availability I will not have them until next week some time I will be installing one ASAP to see how it operates and then go with the second one.

I will keep you all up to date.

[bchurch]

Ron,

Thanks for the good press. You are too kind! I love to be part of the solution and not the problem. That's one reason I started Karrier Company. It hasn't been easy, but just knowing we are making the job of the hard working man easier is really gratifying. I offer good products for fair prices and I try to never overstate their capabilities.

Wishing everyone of you a white and merry Christmas,

Bob Church
President,
Karrier Company
Ph: 800-709-4434
www.karrierco.com

[wyldman]

Welcome Bob,glad to have you aboard here. :D

[bchurch]

Glad to be here.

[nsmilligan]

Ron
Just wondering how you made out with the Omega controller?

Bill

[John DiMartino]

I too spoke with Bob,and he is very knowledgeable,and helpful.Since he is out of stock on that controller,he is sending it overnight,no extra charge this week.Like Ron said this cpntroller isnt cheap,but I think its built much better than the one it will replace.Good to see you here Bob!

[4evergreenlawns]

Bill,

I should see the controller by the end of the week. I will let you all know how it works out as soon as I get some hours out of it.

John,

I am glad you were able to talk with Bob, I knew you were in need of a controller. I am depending in the adage "youy get what you pay for" when it comes to the price. I bought two of them $$$$$.

Bob,

I hope you know what you are getting yourself into. People on this site are of the highest caliber with a level of candor unmatched. I hope to give your product rave and best reviews. With all the snow we have seen over the weekend I only wish I would have already had the new controller in my hands. We spread over 40Tons total of salt in three days out of three trucks.

[JustUsDe]

I wish I would of seen this thread before I bought more Fisher controllers. I smoke them on a regular basis too. Looks like I will be talking to Bob soon also. Thanks for the link Chris. Welcome to the site Bob.


Ray

[4evergreenlawns]

Finally had some time to install the Omega II. Took some time due to haveing to re-wire the entire set up but seems like it is going to get the job done. One in for testing now we need some more snow so I can get some apps down. Second unit sitting on the shelf in the box for now.

I will get some pics of the new unit installed in the next few days. It does look great.

Bob,

Why the long lag in powering down??? Unit come right on when the switch comes on but when turning the power off seems like it take forever as the lights dim and go out on the controller while the spreader is off, or is it???

Also the unit goes to stop at about 3.5 on the speed setting. Meaning you are only getting 10- 3.5/ 3.5-10 for speed control.

Should I not have have adjustment from 10-0?? What is happening between 3.5 - 0 and from 0 - 3.5?????

Have you had any problems with the on/off switch?? Is this something you stock? Knowing the switches themself were something that pleagued the SnowEx controller which you designed I guess you had something to do with improving the qualitiy of the switch.

Will the power switch stand up to several hundred cycles per event, 40-50 events a season without fail??

Is the power switch something I can buy and have on hand as back up???

The overall unit does seem bullet proof and built for heavy duty use in compairison to the buyer single controller I was toasting, but just being honest the power switch has me concerned.

I see your listing on Ebay for both the I and II. I guess it is another way to get the product to the market place hope sales go well.



John,

Any feedback to date??

[John DiMartino]

I only have a few hrs on my Omega 2,we had a nice ice storm the day i got it,and not a thing since.I noticed the same thing when powering down,there is a delay,its no big deal,now that i know about it,but my stock controller didnt have any delay. I cannot use anything below #5 on the auger,it wont spin below #5.The spinner i can use down to #3-4,any lower and it wont spin up.I liked the stock controller better for control,because you could crawl the auger and spinner down to nothing and they still spun.Tghe on-off button does seem a bit cheap,we'll see how it holds up.Overall though Im happy with the new controller,and glad there is no computer controls in it,like the trynex unit.With the omega i can run the vibrator and auger,without running the spinner.This makes filling 5 gallon-45 gallon buckets with salt very easy,slip the lip under the back,and fill it in no time.Thats one thing i hated with the stock controller,it wanted to "see" the spinners resistance,if it didnt ,it wouldnt turn on the controller.

[4evergreenlawns]

John,

Thanks. Now I know it is not just me or the controller I am using. I would think for the price the unit should function at full range in ALL modes. I am sure Bob can shed some light on the issue and do something to address the condition.

Bob????

[BRL]

Welcome to the site Bob!

Just venturing a guess here. Maybe the tolerances of specific spreaders don't allow the full spectrum of the controller's abilities for each case? For example on another brand of spreader it may work from 1 - 9 vs the 3.5 - 10 on that spreader. Since it is being used with multiple brands & is not a brand specific unit, this seems like a plausible reason for the differences. A delay for the turning off, that sounds interesting & I can't wait to hear the answers to the questions pertaining to that.

[GMC Driver]

John and Ron,

As mentioned previously, The Omega II is the same unit used on the Salt Dogg. While I have noticed the lag when turning the unit off, it seems to 'fade" to off - not a big deal, but takes some getiing used to.

I have not experienced the limited range in controller functions that you are experiencing - spinner functions right down to 1, same with the auger. I have gotten in the habit of just setting the spinner control to a set speed prior to turning the unit on, and then simply feeding the spinner by using the auger control - at the end of a run, or drive, I simply turn the auger to zero, and stop the auger - this seems to work for me (but then again, I need things kept simple.) This way I am only using the power switch twice at each lot - or about 100 times per salt run. I haven't experienced problems with the switch at this point.

Bill might have touched on something with the differences in different brands - I guess Bob can clarify this.

[4evergreenlawns]

BRL,

After hearing what GMC has to say about the operating range on the Salt Dog you might be right, however, Bob boasted about how the controller is programed VIA P/C for range/load differences and how he wanted to know about how it works in different applications. I am not sure if there is some deviation allowed in the programing for different application but if there is HOW is Bob going to take measures/measurement to be sure the unit is being programed to match the appilication it is being purchased for??? Furthermore, if the unit is being marketed VIA EBAY I am sure there will many more applications for which it will be installed and what are those end users going to expect??? At $500.00 I want the unit to be operating at 100% as would anyone else.

Although the Buyers units were toasting at a rate of two per season, when they were working the range of operation was 100% and they only cost me $125.00 per unit.

As for the slow FADE to off I am concerned about a spike during on/off/on cycles. In my mind this can not be good for the unit. Although power to the motor might be terminated, is the board and such in a slow fade power down, than you hit the power switch to appliy more salt and here comes a FULL LOAD to the board that is in power down mode?? ON is ON and OFF should be OFF, right????

Bob had spoke to me at great lenght about his product during the introductory call, so much so that I spent $1,000.00 based on one phone call to him. He also proudly stood behind its capabilities and dependability (stating he would take them both back for full refund if they were installed and not 100% what he promissed).

Now I would really like to hear more about the actual application seeing how it is installed in my truck and not really up to par (operating ragne) IMHO. My thinking is 10-3.5 is about 65% operating capacity assuming full range of operation at 100% would be 10-0, correct?? If so, should I only be billed 65% of $485.00???? That being the case why would I buy anything knowing it only works at 65%. All of this just being open conversation at this point until Bob can chime in.


GMC,

I am truly GLAD to hear the unit has worked without fail in your application with the Salt Dogg. I like what you mentioned about how you are working the unit to avoid on/off cycles. I was doing something close to that previously with the Spinner on the Speed controller and the auger on a on/off switch. I would leave the spinner running and the feed with the auger on/off switch controlling drop rate with the feed gate and spreader width VIA the speed controller.

Again my concern it what is actually happening between 3.5-0. I do not want the controller or either of the motors to encounted an adverse effect due to some low voltage/amp like what happens to the Blizzard motor when it lack AMPs under power and fries the windings.

Again, I made this purchase decsion to maximize the production of an already GREAT end item. I did not make a $500.00 purchase to only get maybe, kinda, some imporvement.

All this being said without having any operation hours on the controller to date just observation after the install which required me to RE-WIRE the entire set up (about 4 man hours and $75.00 in supplies) with NO wiring harness offered by Karrier.


Awaiting Bob's reply.

[4evergreenlawns]

Well boys and girls a very good reliable friend just dropped me a little link that is just going to make things very very interesting. Seems like the Omega II is a Rose by another name but still a Rose.

John,

Take a look, maybe you have seen this item somewhere before.

http://www.spectrum-engineering.com/02/index1111.htm


Mr. Church???????

We will be talking in the AM you can be assure of that......

[Lawngodfather]

Ron - I think the motors you are controlling draw too much for the buyers unit.

I think this is what you want,it seems like a great unit.Available in single or dual motor control.

Omega variable speed controllers (http://www.karrierco.com/cgi-bin/shopper.exe?search=action&keywords=Omega)
Only $249 direct from the mfg.

Wow half price............

http://www.spectrum-engineering.com/02/index1111.htm

[4evergreenlawns]

Mike,

Funny thing is Bob Church stated he was the MFG, and the designer. Well not so funny actually.

[Lawngodfather]

That's why he changed the name.

I did a simple search for it when I saw an auction for it on ebay last year.

This way you only come up with his web site.

If he used SPECTRUM ENGINEERING you could search for it and find the MFG like I did.

All I had was a part number though. 3420A and 5 minutes of my time, I found the MFG.

[4evergreenlawns]

Mike,

Once again I will say your presence here has been missed. Might have costed me $500.00 and others half that.

Thanks again.

[4evergreenlawns]

The pricing issue having been handled in a professional manner by Bob Church I had a chance to put the Omega II to the test as we had a slating event last night.

It is with great regret I am reporting that the Omega II failed to operate the Auger at all under condtions that were routine.

I loaded as always and rushed out to the first job to see what I would going to get. What I got was to see the reversing action of the Auger controller but it never once fed any salt. I made several attempts and nothing. While having the shoveler turn the unit on/off what I observed was the auger turning about 1/8 than reversing 1/8 for two cycles than going into jam mode.

Went back to the shop hooked the previous wiring back up and the Auger fed salt at the first flip of the switch. I did use the Spinner controller portion of the Omega II with great results.

Not sure why but I can tell you that I have not intentions of being the beta testing vehicle for this product.

I will be returning both of the Omega II's and going with what I was initially looking for and that is a Heavy duty Spinner controll which is availabel VIA Karrier. I will continue to operate the auger on the On/Off switch method as that has never failed me form day one.


Atgreen,

There is your answer. I would not take a chance wiring it up to a V box unless some one at Downeaster can tell you the motor on the V box is so different from the motor being used on the Tailgate Spreader that you would not have the same issue. For the Spinner controll I see no reason why the Omega Spinner control would not work.

Good Luck. Hope that helps.

[John DiMartino]

I had a few more salt runs with the Omega 2.The unit works well,the only issue i have is the low speed control of the aguer,and spinner isnt 100%.I need to keep the auger on #3-4 absolute minimum,and the spinner about the same.Sometimes i can run them a little lower,depending on the amount in the spreader and how wet it is. So with the exception of that shortcoming, im happy with the controller itself,and how Bob Church has handled the whole situation with the controller.

[4evergreenlawns]

Just a photo other than the stock one on the page.

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d180/4evergreenlawns/000_0349.jpg

[4evergreenlawns]

Sent one of the Omega II back to Karrier and I the replacement Omega I arrived a few day later.

I have not been able to install the I and remove the II from my truck but I will say Bob Church at Karrier has been nothing short of professional, creditable, and dependable. He has followed through on everything he has promissed. Reguardless of the fact the the Omega II did not work for me, if it works in your application I strongly recommend this as a replacement controller.

I will post my experience with the Omega I with time.

Please fell free to PM me should anyone have any question about my experience with Karrier and/or Omega spreader controllers.

Ron

[4evergreenlawns]

Just wanted to follow up as promissed.

I finally installed the Omega I spinner controller. It works great. I get 100% speed control from Max down to Min/Stop and up to Max again. Here is a pic.

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d180/4evergreenlawns/000_0368.jpg